Is everyone not understanding the value in the Pixels pricing?

[cbreze]

So quickly people look at the hardware and cry that it's not enough of an upgrade over "my phone". Skipping over the fact that this phone has the bleeding edge specs people beg for, there is so much money invested in the research and development into the software exclusive to the Pixels it's insane. The new AI system is more advanced than anything we've seen! This is not the basic "ok Google" that is on most phones. They also went above and beyond to create the BEST camera ever in a smartphone. Something everyone asks for. You're also getting unlimited FULL resolution storage in Google photos. Exclusive to the Pixels. You also will have up to the minute SECURITY updates. Another feature you ask for in a flagship.

And one other exclusive feature that most are forgetting that the general public will love. 24HR LIVE SUPPORT right on your phone. Non tech consumers will greatly value this. These things are not free folks!! These are the reasons you buy Pixels. Not just your basic hardware upgrade. The exclusive support for these devices is unmatched on Android.

Thank You....rant over

Not really onboard with your logic. The "bleeding edge" specs are not really that great. Better than a 6P? Sure, but $400+ better? Everything comes with a certain amount of R+D to get it to market. So what? All products have this, doesn't mean they charge to much. Some do and regret it later. Henry Ford brought cars to the middle class by making more so he could sell them for less. When it comes to tech stuff some people are seemingly addicted to having the latest and greatest. The manufacturers know this and play it up big time since they also know their shiny new tech will be getting stale soon. It remains to be seen how this new assistant will shape up as far as having more or same value as the old one, ok google? The 24 hour tech chat hot line is totally meh and not worth any extra money IMHO. Maybe it should be an option for those willing to pay for it. Wonder how many takers there'd be. But maybe the general populace might think thats a big "wow' Factor. Not sure what the big deal is about the storage. I get that with my other recent Androids if I choose to use it. Don't ever really need 100GB. Over kill, but again another "wow' factor. Lastly, up to the "minute" security updates. Hafta see how this plays out over time, but to the "minute" seems like another "wow' factor thing and not at all necessary. Monthly is pretty fine and Nexus got that and maybe still getting? Not even sure monthly is that necessary.
Having said this I like the pixel and would def get one if I were phone shopping. But it's kind of interesting all the extra stuff Google is touting as really cool when it just doesn't make it worth the extra bucks. If it weren't for the installment plan payments I wonder how many would pony up the cash. Yeah, rack it up on the credit card because I "gotta" have it. Lots of those folks. The Verizon's out there love it when your on a payment plan forever by upgrading every year or so.
The pixel is no doubt a great phone for today. It will be interesting how all the new adopters like it and how the things they are playing up as nice extras, 24/7 help line, etc. go over the long haul. Long haul? In tech life the long haul isn't very long at all.
Nothing against your topic OP, just my .02

 

[Wiley_11]

Or the best one of all, look at those Bezels!

Pardon me but I think the oversized bezels are redonkulous!.........

 

[petvas72]

So quickly people look at the hardware and cry that it's not enough of an upgrade over "my phone". Skipping over the fact that this phone has the bleeding edge specs people beg for, there is so much money invested in the research and development into the software exclusive to the Pixels it's insane. The new AI system is more advanced than anything we've seen! This is not the basic "ok Google" that is on most phones. They also went above and beyond to create the BEST camera ever in a smartphone. Something everyone asks for. You're also getting unlimited FULL resolution storage in Google photos. Exclusive to the Pixels. You also will have up to the minute SECURITY updates. Another feature you ask for in a flagship.

And one other exclusive feature that most are forgetting that the general public will love. 24HR LIVE SUPPORT right on your phone. Non tech consumers will greatly value this. These things are not free folks!! These are the reasons you buy Pixels. Not just your basic hardware upgrade. The exclusive support for these devices is unmatched on Android.

Thank You....rant over

It is obvious that we pay for the support and the Google Photos storage. The thing is, how many people really need both these things? If you take these two features out of the equation, you get a very expensive phone that is not worth the money, when compared with other Android devices.
People that need this support and have an enormous amount of photos, will see a value in getting the Pixel.

 

[FlyBri]

Actually, there is a third reason people are bashing it -- they don't see the relative value to the price. If the phone had the performance of the PC specs you mentioned in your previous post, that phone would be worth thousands of dollars (every penny of it). Sure you'll get trolls who will always complain, but there are valid points to be very critical of the pricing of the phone, and you can be completely level-headed when arguing that point.

The Pixel sounds like it'll end up being a damn good phone, but for the money, you can make an easy argument that for some people out there, the value proposition is very poor for them, and thus the phones are way overpriced. For one, it's completely valid that people are saying it's missing features that other phones have at the same price. Water resistance and SD card support are totally valid reasons (and I know Google phones don't have support for SD cards, so not like that's a surprise, but still). The most comparably equipped Pixel is more than a Note 7 from T-Mobile, and the Note 7 has full stylus support, which is a HUGE feature (among other things missing on the Pixel). Now, there are people that won't care because they won't need it, but that's not the point -- the point is there is a huge feature that the Note 7 has that is missing from the Pixel (not to mention the Note 7 also has a larger screen as well for basically the same size).

I'll use myself as an example. FYI, I just recently switched from a Note 5 to an Axon 7.

So lets go through some of the things the Pixel has. The Pixel has 24/7 support. That's great, but I have no need for it, so any additional cost baked into the phone for that I have absolutely no need for. Also, Apple arguably has a better support situation, as you can go into a physical location same day to get it diagnosed and possibly replaced. My Axon 7, while it has no 24/7 support like the Pixel has, has advanced exchanges, for instance, at no additional cost. Does the Pixel have this, or do I need to purchase the $100 protection plan as well.

Pixel hardware -- the main internals are marginally better than what is out there. The Snapdragon 821 is, at most, only 10% faster than the 820, and it seems like Google is running the 821 in the Pixel at a lower frequency, so it's probably not even going to have that kind of margin over the 820. The camera still has to be widely tested, but I'm sure at the very least it'll compete with the best out there. But will it be head-and-shoulders above the iPhone 7 and S7/Note 7? I'm betting probably not.

Pixel comes with unlimited full resolution storage through Google. That's a good addition, but I don't know how many people actually care about this. And for people that do, like me, I already have all the storage I need through OneDrive, for example, so again, this "value-add" for someone like me is essentially worthless.

From a specs perspective, my Axon 7, for example, only costs $400, but competes with the Pixel XL in a lot of ways. Processor is almost the same (has a Snapdragon 820), same amount of RAM, has 64GB of internal storage (which to me is the sweet spot right now -- a good amount of people need more than 32GB now, but not more than 64GB, so the fact that the Pixel phones come with a base of 32GB instead of 64GB, and only has a 128GB option, and no 64GB option, is ridiculous, IMO). The Axon 7 comes with dual-sim/SD card support though if you need more, but like I said, I can see people easily going over 32GB nowadays, but not over 64GB.

My Axon 7 I think can be argued is a better media consumption device. Screens are basically the same between the Axon 7 and the Pixel XL -- 5.5" QHD AMOLED. The Axon 7 though has dual front-facing speakers with Dolby Atmos support, which easily puts it over the top in that regards. People are sad that Google abandoned front-facing speakers, and I think that's a completely valid complaint.

Camera is definitely better on the Pixel, no question, but the Axon 7 can take very good photos, and would probably be more than acceptable to many people. In any case, I think it's hard to argue that having a better camera makes the large price discrepancy between the two phones acceptable.

Build quality on my Axon 7 is top-notch, made of premium materials, and would argue looks better than the Pixel (obviously completely subjective). So it's not like I have some cheaply made phone in comparison.

We'll have to see how the Pixel and Pixel XL battery life is, but it's astonishingly good on my Axon 7 -- my Note 5 doesn't even come close.

So far I've been extremely happy with my Axon 7, and overall am happier with it than even with my Note 5. Point is, for many people like myself, it's becoming harder nowadays to justify spending a ton of money (over twice as much sometimes) when the added value is very little for them. We're in a new era now where there are great Android phones out there for very little money that also sacrifice very little. This isn't to say that the Pixel phones won't be great and won't provide value-add for others -- I understand I'm not the only use case out there. And that's great (although I'd still argue that even with those that would be taking advantage of that added value in the Pixel, that the phones should still be cheaper than they are (and I believe the most expensive config should be no more than $750, IMO). But for people like myself, I think we have every right to think the Pixel is ridiculously overpriced, because we may possibly only get 10-15%, maybe at most 20% (I'm stretching here) more out of a phone like the Pixel, but would basically have to pay over 100% more for that added value. That's just a weak value proposition.

See, no trolling, and a completely level-headed argument that I believe has strong points backing it.

 

[justnivek]

It is obvious that we pay for the support and the Google Photos storage. The thing is, how many people really need both these things? If you take these two features out of the equation, you get a very expensive phone that is not worth the money, when compared with other Android devices.
People that need this support and have an enormous amount of photos, will see a value in getting the Pixel.

https://support.google.com/photos/answer/6220791?hl=en

In the above link google tells you how to use google photos storage

"High quality Unlimited free storage."

I read a little more info before leaving this comment and found a FAQ section and clicked on this question

"What if I choose High quality and I back up photos taken with a high-resolution camera?

If the camera takes photos with 16 megapixels (MP) resolution or lower, most stored photos will essentially look the same using either storage option.
If the camera takes photos with a resolution higher than 16 MP, then photos will be downsized to 16 MP."

So basically, you're getting unlimited storage for photo's AND videos up to 16mp/1080p

So the only people currently that this benefits (that i'm aware of) is the Xperia line of users and the HTC M9 that want to upload full res pics over the 16mp limit and people who record 4k video that would want to upgrade to a pixel just based on that fact alone, it could be the phone they currently use is broken or old but for storage wise any phone even iOS gets unlimited free backup (OK seriously how many users record in 4K anyways? YouTube uploaders? I mean 1080p recording is plenty and probably what the average user records in anyways AGAIN JUST MY OPINION)

And if it degrades the quality a tiny bit so what? you're getting unlimited FREE storage (I don't think anyone would want to delete that once in a while perfect photo off the phone anyway)

EDIT: The support thing is weird for me because anyone who purchases a Nexus or Pixel would know how to use android if you asked me

just my 2¢ again

 

[NexusShark]

Not really onboard with your logic. The "bleeding edge" specs are not really that great. Better than a 6P? Sure, but $400+ better? Everything comes with a certain amount of R+D to get it to market. So what? All products have this, doesn't mean they charge to much. Some do and regret it later. Henry Ford brought cars to the middle class by making more so he could sell them for less. When it comes to tech stuff some people are seemingly addicted to having the latest and greatest. The manufacturers know this and play it up big time since they also know their shiny new tech will be getting stale soon. It remains to be seen how this new assistant will shape up as far as having more or same value as the old one, ok google? The 24 hour tech chat hot line is totally meh and not worth any extra money IMHO. Maybe it should be an option for those willing to pay for it. Wonder how many takers there'd be. But maybe the general populace might think thats a big "wow' Factor. Not sure what the big deal is about the storage. I get that with my other recent Androids if I choose to use it. Don't ever really need 100GB. Over kill, but again another "wow' factor. Lastly, up to the "minute" security updates. Hafta see how this plays out over time, but to the "minute" seems like another "wow' factor thing and not at all necessary. Monthly is pretty fine and Nexus got that and maybe still getting? Not even sure monthly is that necessary.
Having said this I like the pixel and would def get one if I were phone shopping. But it's kind of interesting all the extra stuff Google is touting as really cool when it just doesn't make it worth the extra bucks. If it weren't for the installment plan payments I wonder how many would pony up the cash. Yeah, rack it up on the credit card because I "gotta" have it. Lots of those folks. The Verizon's out there love it when your on a payment plan forever by upgrading every year or so.
The pixel is no doubt a great phone for today. It will be interesting how all the new adopters like it and how the things they are playing up as nice extras, 24/7 help line, etc. go over the long haul. Long haul? In tech life the long haul isn't very long at all.
Nothing against your topic OP, just my .02

When you start to pick apart the software and features of course the price doesn't work then. Google has packaged everything as a whole though in the Pixels. IMO they feel that "blank feature" and time spent developing it has a dollar value to them. They tried the whole Henry Ford approach with the Nexus lines. Even taking a loss or breaking even on every phone sold did not produce sales or interest outside the tech community. Seems like they decided to try a different approach and created the Pixels. No where am I saying they are going to have record sales and I'm not saying this phone is better than any other. If there are other phones out there that cost more or less that appease people then they will buy them. Google invested heavily in their software and services. IMO they placed a value on this and are just looking for a return on investment.

 

[Todd Anthony1]

**My take on the high price**

Yes, in this world you get what you pay for; we all know this. However, I highly doubt that this camera will be the best camera in the industry and surpass Samsung, LG and even the iPhone 7s camera (which improved).

Next, let's say the camera is at least on par with the names mentioned above; what specifically about the software experience is only capable on the Pixel, and not the Nexus 6P or even 5X with the 808? Yes, the 821 is the latest and greatest, but as we know with the Note7 (which I own), just because you have the 820 doesn't mean it will be significantly faster than everything else out there- I realize Touchwiz has a lot to do with this and the stock Android experience keeps even the oldest of processors running smoothly (I have an N5 and 5X as two of my backup phones).

What I am getting at, is that Google is choosing to have these "software features" (and that's what they are) almost proprietary to the Pixel lineup, when other Google driven devices at half the cost would perform these same functions just as well if they receive the update at the same time. It seems like Google is making us pay for the 7.1 software updates now, as the existing hardware on the 6P is fully capable of running the Assistant, a VR experience (has a 2k display) and some sort of update to the camera, which is decent already.

Am I off base with this? I welcome other people's thoughts...

 

[MrSlippery519]

Part of the problem is you cant make everyone happy, we all know this already but every time a new phone is released we get to experience it.

As much as everyone "claims" they loved the Nexus strategy lets be honest, it was a failure in terms or sales and more importantly profit for Google. The Pixel is aiming to change that strategy, it essentially has the best hardware specs you can currently put in a phone and yes you pay for that. It will never be the right answer for every body but I do think this is a step in the right direction for Android as a whole.

They seem to be attempted to become much more mainstream, directly going after Apple with a Google branded phone. The carriers (in Canada at least) are already advertising and have listings and offers on the front page which is typically held for Apple products.

 

[NexusShark]

**My take on the high price**

Yes, in this world you get what you pay for; we all know this. However, I highly doubt that this camera will be the best camera in the industry and surpass Samsung, LG and even the iPhone 7s camera (which improved).

Next, let's say the camera is at least on par with the names mentioned above; what specifically about the software experience is only capable on the Pixel, and not the Nexus 6P or even 5X with the 808? Yes, the 821 is the latest and greatest, but as we know with the Note7 (which I own), just because you have the 820 doesn't mean it will be significantly faster than everything else out there- I realize Touchwiz has a lot to do with this and the stock Android experience keeps even the oldest of processors running smoothly (I have an N5 and 5X as two of my backup phones).

What I am getting at, is that Google is choosing to have these "software features" (and that's what they are) almost proprietary to the Pixel lineup, when other Google driven devices at half the cost would perform these same functions just as well if they receive the update at the same time. It seems like Google is making us pay for the 7.1 software updates now, as the existing hardware on the 6P is fully capable of running the Assistant, a VR experience (has a 2k display) and some sort of update to the camera, which is decent already.

Am I off base with this? I welcome other people's thoughts...

How do you know that all of the software will work flawlessly with the 6p and others? From what I have heard is that the software is integrated with the hardware in the Pixel. Optimized for it. I am not a code writing expert at all, but hasn't it always been said that the reason iPhone works so well is the fact that Apple designs the hardware and software to work together? Google has finally taken control of the hardware development like everyone has always wanted. Now that they don't want to give it all away for free people have an issue with a phone that no one is forcing them to buy

 

[tpmbb10]

If this is Google's own flagship offering then I understand that they're charging a flagship price that's on par with other flagships. That's the easy part.
Value is in the eye of the beholder. People that have pre-ordered or plan to buy it DO see value and I can only hope they realise that value. People that don't see the value will look elsewhere.

Personally I think people are starting to think twice when the see the price of the flagship phones, but are less shocked when they see it next to a known quantity like iPhone or Galaxy than new players like the Pixel or underdogs like the HTC 10.

 

[Todd Anthony1]

How do you know that all of the software will work flawlessly with the 6p and others? From what I have heard is that the software is integrated with the hardware in the Pixel. Optimized for it. I am not a code writing expert at all, but hasn't it always been said that the reason iPhone works so well is the fact that Apple designs the hardware and software to work together? Google has finally taken control of the hardware development like everyone has always wanted. Now that they don't want to give it all away for free people have an issue with a phone that no one is forcing them to buy

Fair questions and points, but as someone has does write code I call BS on Google's part. What improvement (minus the camera) is hardware driven? Buying a Google device (Nexus, Pixel, whatever they call it 5 years from now) comes with the expectation of receiving Google updates timely... like buying an iPhone. You get the updates as they are released without carrier and OEM interference. You used the word "FREE", when updates are something that is expected to come along with the original purchase.

 

[NexusShark]

Fair questions and points, but as someone has does write code I call BS on Google's part. What improvement (minus the camera) is hardware driven? Buying a Google device (Nexus, Pixel, whatever they call it 5 years from now) comes with the expectation of receiving Google updates timely... like buying an iPhone. You get the updates as they are released without carrier and OEM interference. You used the word "FREE", when updates are something that is expected to come along with the original purchase.

How I see it is the Pixels are now Google's hardware line. Nexus runs stock Android. If Google puts all of the Pixel features into stock Android then every other hardware manufacturer will now have access to them all and the Pixel will no longer be unique. This is my belief of one of many reasons that the Nexus line is dead. Google is not just a software company with a random vessel to get stock Android out anymore. They are in direct competition with hardware manufacturers now and need something to market as their own. They even said the Pixel is a separate division from Android. They take Google's version of Android just like any manufacturer and tweak it for their line of Pixels.

 

[tpmbb10]

Buying a Google device (Nexus, Pixel, whatever they call it 5 years from now) comes with the expectation of receiving Google updates timely... like buying an iPhone. You get the updates as they are released without carrier and OEM interference. You used the word "FREE", when updates are something that is expected to come along with the original purchase.

I think you've identified the disconnect. Based on what I read on AC leading up to the Pixel release, Pixel and Nexus are two different product lines where Nexus = "stock" Android and Pixel is not....It has little or nothing to do with hardware - Google has drawn a line in the sand and have effectively become an OEM with their own flagship and selected these features to differentiate themselves from other phones, including Nexus. Now if I were a Nexus owner used to having "the latest and greatest from Google" would I be bent out of shape? Meh. They'll still get Nougat and such before virtually every other phone. And Google is charging more for the Pixel, so I'd probably still feel pretty good about the original value proposition of my Nexus.

 

[justnivek]

What I am getting at, is that Google is choosing to have these "software features" (and that's what they are) almost proprietary to the Pixel lineup, when other Google driven devices at half the cost would perform these same functions just as well if they receive the update at the same time.

I agree with this 100% because I had an iPhone 4 and siri was a 4s feature because the 4 "couldn't handle it"

Well I'll have everyone know that my jailbroken iPhone 4 had little to no problems with siri (people moded it onto the 4, if apple put it on the 4 it would've been flawless)

 

[LailaAK]

I think you've identified the disconnect. Based on what I read on AC leading up to the Pixel release, Pixel and Nexus are two different product lines where Nexus = "stock" Android and Pixel is not....It has little or nothing to do with hardware - Google has drawn a line in the sand and have effectively become an OEM with their own flagship and selected these features to differentiate themselves from other phones, including Nexus. Now if I were a Nexus owner used to having "the latest and greatest from Google" would I be bent out of shape? Meh. They'll still get Nougat and such before virtually every other phone. And Google is charging more for the Pixel, so I'd probably still feel pretty good about the original value proposition of my Nexus.

true, but the Nexus phones will probably never get Oreo update.

 

[jam4775]

Not really onboard with your logic. The "bleeding edge" specs are not really that great. Better than a 6P? Sure, but $400+ better? Everything comes with a certain amount of R+D to get it to market. So what? All products have this, doesn't mean they charge to much. Some do and regret it later. Henry Ford brought cars to the middle class by making more so he could sell them for less. When it comes to tech stuff some people are seemingly addicted to having the latest and greatest. The manufacturers know this and play it up big time since they also know their shiny new tech will be getting stale soon. It remains to be seen how this new assistant will shape up as far as having more or same value as the old one, ok google? The 24 hour tech chat hot line is totally meh and not worth any extra money IMHO. Maybe it should be an option for those willing to pay for it. Wonder how many takers there'd be. But maybe the general populace might think thats a big "wow' Factor. Not sure what the big deal is about the storage. I get that with my other recent Androids if I choose to use it. Don't ever really need 100GB. Over kill, but again another "wow' factor. Lastly, up to the "minute" security updates. Hafta see how this plays out over time, but to the "minute" seems like another "wow' factor thing and not at all necessary. Monthly is pretty fine and Nexus got that and maybe still getting? Not even sure monthly is that necessary.
Having said this I like the pixel and would def get one if I were phone shopping. But it's kind of interesting all the extra stuff Google is touting as really cool when it just doesn't make it worth the extra bucks. If it weren't for the installment plan payments I wonder how many would pony up the cash. Yeah, rack it up on the credit card because I "gotta" have it. Lots of those folks. The Verizon's out there love it when your on a payment plan forever by upgrading every year or so.
The pixel is no doubt a great phone for today. It will be interesting how all the new adopters like it and how the things they are playing up as nice extras, 24/7 help line, etc. go over the long haul. Long haul? In tech life the long haul isn't very long at all.
Nothing against your topic OP, just my .02

I'm not sure where you get "$400+ better"... the 6P wasn't $400+ cheaper than the Pixel when it was released. You're comparing today's 6P prices to the Pixel's, that's a ridiculous comparison.

Although, I do think Google should have priced these Pixels $100 cheaper across the line, to be a little more competitive... it puts them in a tough position when they price them exactly the same as the Note 7 and iPhone. Otherwise I do think Google provides a lot of value with hardware, software, and support. I've actually used Google's support before on my 6P when I got locked out of my phone after an update... they were quick to answer my call, very nice on the phone, and were quick to remotely unlocked my phone. Was a good experience, which they've made even easier to use on the Pixel.

 

[LyricalNonsense]

The amount of features it brings dwarfs those of other flagships, so the pricing is completely reasonable imo.

 

[TheMysteriousOne]

Do you plan on going scuba diving with it? Or just hung up on specs?

Lol... you can't go scuba diving with IP67... that only gives you up to 1 metre play

People want water resistance for reasons like codeda mentioned... we don't all live in deserts

 

[rsbenedict]

I just watched a video where the iPhone 7 was placed in water less than a foot deep and for less than 5 minutes and has water damage to both the front and rear cameras. It doesn't look like permanent damage, but water got in the lenses. I've never dropped my phone in water and have little fear about most rain, unless it's a downpour, but from what I've seen, getting an IP rating in the lab doesn't always equate to real-world experience. Many people have ruined a phone in water that was so-called "water-proof."

 

[LailaAK]

Lol... you can't go scuba diving with IP67... that only gives you up to 1 metre play

People want water resistance for reasons like codeda mentioned... we don't all live in deserts

does Verizon even have underwater cellular signal towers
so people can scuba dive and tweet on the Pixel phone at
the same time?