Nexus 5 is better than the iPhone.

[mrsmumbles]

Because 4.4 only requires 512MB to run? Because they want to be able to bring KitKat to a broader range of devices, meaning low to mid range? I figured that was public knowledge. Maybe I'm playing a little too much "inside baseball" for you guys.

I agree that it's great that KitKat can run well on phones with lesser hardware. The trick is how that phone will perform once a user adds custom apps and media files.

Whereas a phone with great specs like the n5 will still perform great under such circumstances, it isn't clear whether the motog will and it's almost certain phones like my old hydro will not.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk 2

 

[LegalAmerican]

They are a better indication than any other metric for that. They do not have to be 100% to have value.

See that's where my opinion differs. The way the device feels in my hand (mixed with the knowledge I have) tells me more than some tech websites benchmark tests. I know you're saying it's impossible to anticipate future performance without it, but knowing what I know about how the Nexus 5 is built and how 4.4 operates, i'm not concerned about how it will function in 6 months even without looking at benchmarks. If in 6 months i'm wrong, i'll gladly admit it. And I would be very comfortable saying the Moto X wil be doing just fine also.

 

[Adranalyne]

I agree. You are way too smart. That must the problem.

I thought you'd be busy whining in the comments section to Alex/Andrew/Jerry/Phil about not choosing your device as the best Android phone to buy as of right now. Are you still in disagreement about the speed thing? I don't mind that you're in disagreement about it not being better overall. That's your right to do so. You're just dead wrong about the Nexus 5 being signficantly faster in day to day use and I think you've gone too far with this to turn back now.

 

[JeffDenver]

I agree that it's great that KitKat can run well on phones with lesser hardware. The trick is how that phone will perform once a user adds custom apps and media files.

Whereas a phone with great specs like the n5 will still perform great under such circumstances, it isn't clear whether the motog will and it's almost certain phones like my old hydro will not.

This is futureproofing. I experienced this too on older phones first hand. It is why a "surplus" of power is better even if a lower-specced phone will still run just as well at the moment. A phone that seems really fast right now will probably be less so 6 months or a year from now.

The Droid 1 vs Nexus One was a great example of this. Initially they looked evenly matched. But the nexus had a lot more memory, and was able to do a lot better later on as it aged because of that. The same was true of the Droid Incredible 1. Specs do matter.

 

[LegalAmerican]

Because 4.4 only requires 512MB to run? Because they want to be able to bring KitKat to a broader range of devices, meaning low to mid range? I figured that was public knowledge. Maybe I'm playing a little too much "inside baseball" for you guys.

I had a neighbor that used to come to my house to visit occassionally and during the conversation he'd make statements like: "I don't expect you to understand everything I say because I have a higher IQ than the average person." Yet if anyone was to walk into a street without first looking for cars and then be hit, it'd be him.

Pretty sure no one is playing too much "inside baseball" for anyone else on here. I do agree with you that it's pretty obvious what Google is trying to accomplish here, and mrsmumbles asks you that question because even though it's obvious, it's also practically impossible to explain without sounding pompous. He/she has you in a tough spot with that question but the answer is never that you assume you're smarter than everyone else. That's the best possible way to assure no one will fight in your corner.

 

[JeffDenver]

See that's where my opinion differs. The way the device feels in my hand (mixed with the knowledge I have) tells me more than some tech websites benchmark tests.

That does not mean benchmark tests do not have value. They are not mutually exclusive.

I know you're saying it's impossible to anticipate future performance without it

I said nothing of the kind. I simply said it was the best metric to determine future performance. I still think that. "best" and "perfect" do not mean the same thing.

I would be very comfortable saying the Moto X will be doing just fine also.

I am unconvinced of this personally. But the Moto X is not lagging by a lot anyway. I agree the number of cores is not an indication of speed. The 5s is faster than the Nexus and is "only" dual core.

 

[Shilohcane]

The Nexus 7 uses 4 Krait 300 cores and an Adreno 320. That literally is an S600 except for the clock speed. The S4 Pro from last year doesn't have Krait 300s nor an Adreno 320.

XT1060. Through spacetime.

The Google Play Nexus 7 specs say the 2013 Nexus 7 has a:

" Quad-core Qualcomm Snapdragon™ S4 Pro, 1.5GHz with a GPU Adreno 320, 400MHz" not a S600. I never got into benchmarks of the S600 vs S4 Pro since there are so many versions of the S4 with for tiers and 15 versions. I'm sure they are all fast but Google is saying the Nexus 7 2013 is a S4 Pro.

The S4 family has according to this article four different tiers of S4 and they are not all created equal. Per this article there are currently 15 different Snapdragon S4 models

 

[Adranalyne]

This is futureproofing. I experienced this too on older phones first hand. It is why a "surplus" of power is better even if a lower-specced phone will still run just as well at the moment. A phone that seems really fast right now will probably be less so 6 months or a year from now.

The Droid 1 vs Nexus One was a great example of this. Initially they looked evenly matched. But the nexus had a lot more memory, and was able to do a lot better later on as it aged because of that. The same was true of the Droid Incredible 1. Specs do matter.

They release a Nexus device every year, off contract, for almost upgrade prices. Most people that buy these devices do so under the premise that they'll buy one a year just like with the iPhone. Does that mean everyone will do it? No, but considering you're not under contract and you can, most people probably will. With that said, the futureproofing argument just doesn't hold the same weight anymore, at least not for this year. You're going to see most OEMs go to 64-bit processors like Apple did with the A7---that's futureproofing. That's something that's a good year, probably 2 years, away software-wise, but the 5S will be capable already.

There's nothing that suggests in the next 6-12 months that the Moto X won't be capable of being as fast as it is now. Different hardware (cameras, displays, etc) will come out and need more processing power, but that's irrelevant to phones that don't already have them. This discussion will be pretty funny to look back on in April/May when we're staring at Snapdragon 805 devices and whatever Exynos (probably 6) that Samsung comes out with that will power higher-res displays and 16-20 MP cameras.

 

[Shilohcane]

I have never said that the Nexus 5 was the world's best phone. I do think it is the best phone for under $500 on the market. I like to spend my money wisely and doing research before spending money. I don't like overpaying or getting less value for my money on what is important to me. At the top of my list is the price of the phone unlocked and I like a 5" or larger screen size. I also like open standards and hate walled gardens ecosystems manufactures.

If the LG G2 was the same $349 price as the Nexus 5 I would have got the G2 instead but it doesn't have enough extra value for me to pay $520. If the Moto X was the same $349 as the Nexus 5 I still would have got the Nexus 5 since I see more upside for the things I like in a bigger screen and faster CPU & GPU in the N5 that both phones come from Google.

If these network providers didn't subsidize the initial cost of the phones on these 2 year contracts, which results in over paying for your monthly services for those 2 years we would all be paying a lot less for phones on the market.

 

[mrsmumbles]

They release a Nexus device every year, off contract, for almost upgrade prices. Most people that buy these devices do so under the premise that they'll buy one a year just like with the iPhone. Does that mean everyone will do it? No, but considering you're not under contract and you can, most people probably will. With that said, the futureproofing argument just doesn't hold the same weight anymore, at least not for this year. You're going to see most OEMs go to 64-bit processors like Apple did with the A7---that's futureproofing. That's something that's a good year, probably 2 years, away software-wise, but the 5S will be capable already.

There's nothing that suggests in the next 6-12 months that the Moto X won't be capable of being as fast as it is now. Different hardware (cameras, displays, etc) will come out and need more processing power, but that's irrelevant to phones that don't already have them. This discussion will be pretty funny to look back on in April/May when we're staring at Snapdragon 805 devices and whatever Exynos (probably 6) that Samsung comes out with that will power higher-res displays and 16-20 MP cameras.

But for those of us who probably won't buy another phone for a couple of years, it's nice to know that whatever new apps may be created to take advantage of the 2014 flagship devices' hardware will very likely run just as well on the n5, but maybe not do as well on the Motox. That's how I understand the term future proofing.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Shilohcane]

They release a Nexus device every year, off contract, for almost upgrade prices. Most people that buy these devices do so under the premise that they'll buy one a year just like with the iPhone. Does that mean everyone will do it? No, but considering you're not under contract and you can, most people probably will. With that said, the futureproofing argument just doesn't hold the same weight anymore, at least not for this year. You're going to see most OEMs go to 64-bit processors like Apple did with the A7---that's futureproofing. That's something that's a good year, probably 2 years, away software-wise, but the 5S will be capable already.

Most people aren't phone junkies that switch phones every year. I have never upgraded a phone every year even under contract since it extends the contract back for another 2 years. I know one friend that gets a new phone every year, only he does it about twice a year. Most of the people I know have have 2 to 3 year old phones. Futureproofing may not hold water to a phone junkie that gets a new phone every year but I want my Nexus 5 to last at least four years. I sure don't buy a new car every time they make a new version of my car so I don't see why I would get a new phone just because it has some new feature that really provides little value. I will never sign another 2 year service contract from a network provider and my Nexus 5 works fine on my $35 a month no-contract service from Metro PCS ( Note I get $5 discount for family plan).

BTW, my friend that switches his phone about every 7 months is always upset that his AT&T phone bill is about $120 each month just for himself.

 

[Adranalyne]

But for those of us who probably won't buy another phone for a couple of years, it's nice to know that whatever new apps may be created to take advantage of the 2014 flagship devices' hardware will very likely run just as well on the n5, but maybe not do as well on the Motox. That's how I understand the term future proofing.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk 2

With 4.4, the Nexus 4 will still be plenty fast at the end of 2014. So will the Moto X. If you choose to not believe the latter, that's fine.

 

[JeffDenver]

With 4.4, the Nexus 4 will still be plenty fast at the end of 2014.

I own a nexus 4 with 4.4 (I installed the factory image). I can tell you the experience is not the same. It is still good, but 4.4 did not result in an significant improvement over what I had before. 4.4 for me basically just gave me some of the UI improvements (which is not a bad thing...I do like the transparent notification and Nav bars).

I don't know that 4.4 if giving a speed boost to any phone. ART might do that, but 4.4 by itself is not.

 

[Rule9]

I don't buy that future proofing argument. In general maybe, but not here. I wonder how many people in general who I've seen using that argument before said they upgrade every two years on this forum without realizing that I've seen them rocking at least 2 phones since 2012. Some of you just finished posting in this very thread that you don't upgrade every year, using the Nexus 5 that you just bought to replace the last phone you owned which just happened to be released around 6 months ago It sheds an interesting light on the credibility of the rest of your arguments when you'll fib that easily for no better reason than to just be contradictory.

I don't care what John Q. Public's upgrade cycle is either, he's not on this website.

 

[Adranalyne]

I own a nexus 4 with 4.4 (I installed the factory image). I can tell you the experience is not the same. It is still good, but 4.4 did not result in an significant improvement over what I had before. 4.4 for me basically just gave me some of the UI improvements (which is not a bad thing...I do like the transparent notification and Nav bars).

I don't know that 4.4 if giving a speed boost to any phone. ART might do that, but 4.4 by itself is not.

I never said it made any speed improvements, although ART comes with 4.4 and may make a difference. I'm saying that 4.4 is designed to run on less powerful hardware. Also, there's probably quite a bit under the hood of 4.4 that allows for performance increases, but nothing that I could pinpoint specifically.

 

[mrsmumbles]

I don't buy that future proofing argument. In general maybe, but not here. I wonder how many people in general who I've seen using that argument before said they upgrade every two years on this forum without realizing that I've seen them rocking at least 2 phones since 2012. Some of you just finished posting in this very thread that you don't upgrade every year, using the Nexus 5 that you just bought to replace the last phone you owned which just happened to be released around 6 months ago It sheds an interesting light on the credibility of the rest of your arguments when you'll fib that easily for no better reason than to just be contradictory.

I don't care what John Q. Public's upgrade cycle is either, he's not on this website.

I didn't lie. My hydro was malfunctioning so I replaced it with the Optimus F7, and my feature phone malfunctions so I replaced it with my Nexus. Now all I have to do is pay the Sprint etf as soon as I can and take my Nexus to Straight Talk or Gophone. I have two phone lines. I don't have any plans to buy another new phone unless the n5 or f7 breaks which (knock cardboard) hopefully they won't.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk 2

 

[JeffDenver]

I never said it made any speed improvements, although ART comes with 4.4 and may make a difference.

In my experience it definitely makes a difference. But it will probably be the same difference on any phone with 4.4. So the difference between two phones with ART will not change. The faster one will still be the faster one.

It might make a bigger difference on some than others...that was how it went when the JIT compiler came out. Some phones only got a small bump. My Droid 1 become 2 or 3 times as fast overnight though.

 

[JeffDenver]

I don't buy that future proofing argument.

I lived it. I know it's real. If futureproofing is not something you are concerned about, then the choice is easy...get a Moto X.

I wonder how many people in general who I've seen using that argument before said they upgrade every two years on this forum without realizing that I've seen them rocking at least 2 phones since 2012. Some of you just finished posting in this very thread that you don't upgrade every year

I didn't used to upgrade every year only because I couldn't. But I always wanted to. For that reason, futureproofing was a big deal to me. because I was stuck with whatever I picked for at least 18 months.

It still matters to me, but not as much now. Now I want the horsepower because I am a heavy user and hate lag.

 

[Adranalyne]

I don't buy that future proofing argument. In general maybe, but not here. I wonder how many people in general who I've seen using that argument before said they upgrade every two years on this forum without realizing that I've seen them rocking at least 2 phones since 2012. Some of you just finished posting in this very thread that you don't upgrade every year, using the Nexus 5 that you just bought to replace the last phone you owned which just happened to be released around 6 months ago It sheds an interesting light on the credibility of the rest of your arguments when you'll fib that easily for no better reason than to just be contradictory.

I don't care what John Q. Public's upgrade cycle is either, he's not on this website.

Part of the appeal of the Nexus is that you're not bogged down to a contract and can upgrade with every new iteration. It's the only reason I bought it. I'd guess that when the next Nexus is released around this time next year, these same people won't mind paying for it if it's a worthy upgrade. Although I'm a little irritated that -now- Moto is selling the Moto X, unlocked and off contract, for the same price as the Nexus 5, albeit for a short period of time. So now even the price argument, even if only for Cyber Monday, is kind of out the window.

 

[JeffDenver]

Part of the appeal of the Nexus is that you're not bogged down to a contract

Thats never been the appeal for me. There are lots of phones you can get off contract. There is nothing better with Vanilla Android though. Thats why I buy Nexus.

Although I'm a little irritated that -now- Moto is selling the Moto X, unlocked and off contract, for the same price as the Nexus 5

Exactly. The Moto G is almost half the price of the Nexus. Off contract is not the main reason to buy a Nexus IMO. It's just a bonus.