Ridiculous verdict in Apple/Samsung case

[JHBThree]

This is one of the things Samsung is going to bring up in regards to the penalty. It's assumed that all that money would've went to Apple had the Samsung devices not exist. That's just not true, and it's next to impossible to put a number on it. I can tell you, it's a lot lower than ~$1 billion.

If it was all of the money, the jury would have given apple the $2 billion they requested. They didn't.

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[JHBThree]

I understand how Steve Jobs felt when he first saw android phones. However, I'd like to live in a world where ideas get shared and we build on top of each others idea so that you don't have to re-invent the wheel all the time.

Speaking of stealing ideas, I think there are plenty examples that Apple stole from Android as well such as pull down notification menu.

Also, it's absurd that Apple is targeting manufacturers not Google.

Not really. Going after Google doesn't stop devices from being sold. Its a lesson apple learned from the Microsoft debacle.

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[JHBThree]

something I made the other day. Should give everyone a chuckle.

APPLE VS THE 10 OF SPADES.
http://db.tt/HuszZsp9

Not only is it not funny, its also inaccurate and is continuing to propagate inaccuracies about the patents in question.

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[Ry]

Who the hell is claiming apple invented capacitive touchscreen phones? Point to where in the quoted text I said anything of the sort.

What I ACTUALLY said was that apple invented and patented several specific multi touch gestures that were used in specific apps in ways that had never been seen before. Those gestures were also coupled with hardware requirements.

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Seems like people read a sensationalised headline and think they know the whole story.


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[badbrad17]

Apple did not "invent" the capacitive touch screen phone. When the iPhone first came out, it was not even a smartphone, it was a feature phone, and it wasn't the first one with a capacitive touch screen. It became a smartphone later in it's life when the App store came out, but it wasn't the first touch screen smartphone, and as was mentioned already, they weren't the first to come out with a multi-touch device. Apple pioneered the interaction with the interface, they made it finger friendly by using gestures that were familiar, and brought it together with the capacitive screen. That was their contribution to the industry.

The patent abuse by the tech industry, not just Apple, is ridiculous. It doesn't spur innovation, it spurs litigation. Companies focus their time on gathering up massive patent portfolios, and many of the patents are on things that they won't even bring to market. Then they just demand ridiculous licensing or sue the crap out of competitors, forcing the little guys to not even bother competing. Sure, people point to Microsoft and say "look, they have a totally new UI", which is ironic, since the icon grid Apple used in part to attack Samsung was made ubiquitous by Windows. Still, it isn't just the UI, it's the patents on generic gestures, features, and "methods" that irk the hell out of me.

Anyway, the penalty does not fit the crime. A number of the phones in the suit were carried by carriers who do/did not offer the iPhone, and many people preferred an Android phone to an iPhone because they liked the OS, or were looking for something in a lower price point. If Samsung has an argument to make to get the verdict tossed, it's that the penalty is unreasonably high considering the availability of the devices in question when placed next to the iPhone. Remember, the amount was supposed to reflect moneys lost to the infringing devices. In many cases, if the infringing devices didn't exist, the money would've went to another, potentially Android, handset.

Also, FWIW, I had a Samsung Fascinate, and one of my biggest gripes with it was it looked too "iPhoney", so I can certainly see why Samsung was dinged for it (I purchased it for the display, size, and thinness). I even mentioned it to friends. Whether or not Apple had the design idea first, or whether Samsung had a basic idea on paper before the iPhone came out is a different story. I would've preferred Samsung not aim the Galaxy S series and Touchwiz at the iPhone as a design benchmark.

Thanks for this post. Very well written. I appreciate the effort in making good intelligent points.

 

[Younjulius]

Not really. Going after Google doesn't stop devices from being sold. Its a lesson apple learned from the Microsoft debacle.

Maybe, still no android OS, no device... Anyway, Apple has its own share of fault in how Windows vs MacOS battle went. Ever since Jobs left, they stopped innovating allowing MS a chance to catch up.

You can't come up with a great idea once, and live off of it for the rest of your life; yes, you can technically, but can't complain too much.

 

[badbrad17]

Who the hell is claiming apple invented capacitive touchscreen phones? Point to where in the quoted text I said anything of the sort.

What I ACTUALLY said was that apple invented and patented several specific multi touch gestures that were used in specific apps in ways that had never been seen before. Those gestures were also coupled with hardware requirements.

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I think his point is more about the fact that we are freaking out over toothpicks now rather that worrying about new ways to cut down trees.

Apple takes aim over little details but shouldn't because they also road in on the backs of so many innovators.

My analogy probably sucked. Lol.

 

[badbrad17]

Not only is it not funny, its also inaccurate and is continuing to propagate inaccuracies about the patents in question.

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Seriously? Wow. I assume you hate shows like Office and Monty Python too. Political and corporate satire is funny. Loosen your tie and learn to laugh about our crazy behaviors. We aren't curing cancer here.

 

[slave2theaxe]

Also, it's absurd that Apple is targeting manufacturers not Google.

Why? Google makes the core software, not the phone or the customized ui of the phone...that is all the manufacturer.


On another note, I'd like to meet the person who says they bought a Samsung phone thinking that it was an iPhone...just so I could punch them in the face for being stupid.

Last time I checked, every flatscreen TV in the world looks pretty much the same and without the brand name on it, I (and most other people in the world) would not be able to tell them apart. Yet I don't see tv manufacturers suing each other over "trade dress"

The premise of this whole case is ridiculous.



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[JHBThree]

I think his point is more about the fact that we are freaking out over toothpicks now rather that worrying about new ways to cut down trees.

Apple takes aim over little details but shouldn't because they also road in on the backs of so many innovators.

My analogy probably sucked. Lol.

No. The 'little details' are what allows devices to recognize that you mean to scroll and not zoom. Apple is not claiming that they invented multi touch, but they are claiming that they have invented gestures that depend on multi touch. There's a huge difference between what he's claiming apple has done and what they have actually done.

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[Johnly]

Simple, drunk apple is asking for a handout. They are clearly to poor to carry on...die apple die.

 

[Ry]

Simple, drunk apple is asking for a handout. They are clearly to poor to carry on...die apple die.

Based on your last few posts, are you sure you're not drunk? Please step away for a bit.

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[badbrad17]

No. The 'little details' are what allows devices to recognize that you mean to scroll and not zoom. Apple is not claiming that they invented multi touch, but they are claiming that they have invented gestures that depend on multi touch. There's a huge difference between what he's claiming apple has done and what they have actually done.

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I agree to what you are saying, I just don't think this should be what we are arguing about. It gets to such a finite detail that innovation can't help but run away and hide in fear of being dragged in to court.

 

[pauldroidr2d2]

I agree to what you are saying, I just don't think this should be what we are arguing about. It gets to such a finite detail that innovation can't help but run away and hide in fear of being dragged in to court.

They only have to fear Apple when Apple begins to feel their sales are being threatened I think. So, it is actually compliment.

 

[badbrad17]

They only have to fear Apple when Apple begins to feel their sales are being threatened I think. So, it is actually compliment.

Well innovative people lurk in small corners of dirty University dorms and are usually poor. They have options to think about a lot of things and I would think that they would choose to only think about things that don't have the potential of ending up in court. Or it could also just be the possibility that their original idea is almost like Apple's original idea which means they lose anyway. Maybe instead this innovative person would choose to be a plumber and not bother with their real passion.

Atlas Shrugged would be a good book to reference perhaps if you haven't read it.

 

[jova33]

This is just a copy of my thoughts on the matter from the Nexus 7 forum.

My first computer was a Macintosh 2. My dad bought it at a garage sale. Apple has been great for the competition. I've never owned any Apple products after that computer. They're too damn expensive.
As far as Samsung copying iPhone designs, you can look at the two side by side and its pretty obvious. They straight up ripped off the iPhone.
And Apple went after Samsung because it's currently selling Google's flagship phone, the Galaxy Nexus. They even managed to prevent sales of the GNex in the US for a couple of weeks? Apple did make themselves out to be the bully in this case.
But I love iPhones. Not that I'll ever own one. But they do lead the way in throwing new ideas out there. IPhone 4S gave us SIRI(edit: i know Apple didn't invent the personal assistant app, but they showed how it could be integrated into the OS and advertised the hell out of it), and now we have Google Now. Google Now even works better than SIRI, and it doesn't cop an attitude with you. I can't wait to see what the iPhone 5 has in store for us. Then android phones will have to one up it.

Everyone copies each other. I just hope this case will teach them not to be so obvious about it.

Edit: additionally I'll be on the Nexus bandwagon for quite awhile. I love how much I can customize everything that I would never be able to with an iDevice. From ROM to kernel to themes to suit my mood. People who buy iPhones like simplicity. And my wife's iPhone takes some amazing pictures.
Did the jury goof some stuff up? Yeah. It's going to get appealed.

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[DaEXfactoR]

Will this crap ever stop?

 

[RichardRight]

Doesn't Coca-Cola have a patent on the "Coke-bottle" shape?

Other Android OEMs have made tons of devices that don't look like iPhones. Just sayin'.

Just saying.

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Actually Coke has a trademark not a patent

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[MrStylz]

I'm not sure what the huge deal is... This is mostly design related. Samsung got dinged for copying their patented designs (mainly). Oh well, pay up and go home. Another jury and another judge would probably have ruled less severe, and they probably will. But it's nothing worrisome.

The true Android related item, pinch to zoom, should get tossed out by a real trial specific to tossing it out as prior art or obvious. I don't think page bounce is part of Stock Android... So not a big deal for overall Android.

Nothing much I'm concerned about for the good of Android....just Samsung/TouchWiz...

 

[pauldroidr2d2]

Will this crap ever stop?

No