Bad Wi-Fi Range

[markdek]

I tried about 80% of the suggestions but some I will have to wait till later to try since I dont wan't to have to restart my router. Roommate is using the internet. Definitely have latest firmware already too. No luck so far.

I downloaded wifi analyzer and i noticed that in the same room a couple feet from the router I get -60dBm and as soon as i pick up the phone and have it in my palm my signal drops by 15-20dB. Anyone care to check if they get similar results?

1) Well, you can't adjust router settings in a public AP, like a coffee shop or book store.

2) And yes,@Auzo, if you put it in your hand in portrait, the signal drops quite a bit.

 

[dcgrand]

@Auzo

Few corrections. The G1 has a TI Transceiver. Check out:

T-Mobile G1 Teardown - iFixit

TI and Intel are best of breed for WLAN Transceivers. Hence the best performance but they are pricier too.

The iPhone has been plagued with bad GSM radio system design. Cant go into much details due to obvious reasons. But in iPhone's case all phones have issues because its basically a design flaw. Cant say that for the evo. Because some say its working gr8 for them. But maybe they are not testing it under various conditions, who knows.

This teardown for EVO:

HTC Evo 4G Teardown - Page 2 - iFixit

Shows that the Wimax and Wifi transceivers are separated well and not sharing the Antenna.

Unfortunately that's not very likely. If the antenna was not connected to the correct interface the WIFI wouldn't be working at all. As for a loose solder joint, its also very unlikely because there are to many people having this problem to be an isolated quality control issue like that.

dcgrand posted a block diagram of the broadcom chip here:
http://forum.androidcentral.com/htc-evo-4g/15564-bad-wi-fi-range-21.html#post156877
There really isn't a way you could connect that antenna up incorrectly that would give you a partially working system.

Also I starting to lean away from the broadcom chip itself being the problem. The AC guys ran some test comparing to other cell phones including the G1, which also uses this chip, And the G1 was arguably best in class.
http://www.androidcentral.com/evo-4g-wifi-test-how-bad-it

I am starting to worry that this can be an antenna problem. Maybe a poor layout design or something.

@dcgrand: Do you know how wideband these antennas typically are? I ask because I have been wondering if maybe they are also using the same antenna (with maybe an additional diplexer) for the 4G signal (2.5GHz) as well . If the antenna bandwidth is normally pretty narrowband, then maybe they detuned it to capture both signals and because of that we are losing some antenna gain.

 

[dcgrand]

@Auzo

Check this out:

Apple - Support - Discussions - ipod touch 3g slow speedtest over wifi ...

Nexus 1 WiFi connectivity problems: hot spots signal too low even I am near those devices. - Android Help

iPod touch users have seen the issue too as well as nexus one users. Again same chip. Now all these devices shouldn't have bad Antenna design.

I am starting to believe its just bad wifi transceiver on some phones. And all the devices that have issues (ipod touch, ipad, evo etc.) are fairly new. So seems like quality control issue from Broadcom. If everything else fails I would swap the phone out for a new one.

Unfortunately that's not very likely. If the antenna was not connected to the correct interface the WIFI wouldn't be working at all. As for a loose solder joint, its also very unlikely because there are to many people having this problem to be an isolated quality control issue like that.

dcgrand posted a block diagram of the broadcom chip here:
http://forum.androidcentral.com/htc-evo-4g/15564-bad-wi-fi-range-21.html#post156877
There really isn't a way you could connect that antenna up incorrectly that would give you a partially working system.

Also I starting to lean away from the broadcom chip itself being the problem. The AC guys ran some test comparing to other cell phones including the G1, which also uses this chip, And the G1 was arguably best in class.
http://www.androidcentral.com/evo-4g-wifi-test-how-bad-it

I am starting to worry that this can be an antenna problem. Maybe a poor layout design or something.

@dcgrand: Do you know how wideband these antennas typically are? I ask because I have been wondering if maybe they are also using the same antenna (with maybe an additional diplexer) for the 4G signal (2.5GHz) as well . If the antenna bandwidth is normally pretty narrowband, then maybe they detuned it to capture both signals and because of that we are losing some antenna gain.

 

[dfine1966]

I guess I am one of the few who wifi is working alright. It signal is a little weaker than I had with the Pre. But, in my house with my router, I have not lost connection and speeds have been comparable to the Pre. I have been testing it out the last few days and it does fluctuate, but have never lost reception from the WIFI. I am curious on what type of Wireless Routers everyone is using. I have a Netgear WNDR3700, which usually is fast, but doesn't have the long range capabilities of some of the other high end devices, like Linksys, but it is pretty fast. Maybe it is the type of router being used that causes the problem. I always look at the simplest solution first, then get to the hard one, like if it is hardware or not.

Their can be many different problems that can cause this. Either it is the Phone's Wifi or the router.

The phone' wifi problem could be hardware or software. I am really starting to think it could possibly be a little of both. If the Wifi signal reader inside the phone is giving a false reading of the strength, and is reporting no bars, the hardware inside the phone will follow a command to say to disconnect. This could be a false reading by the software. In this case, this could be fixed with a software upgrade by HTC and Sprint. Real hardware problems, like a faulty WIFI, usually can't be fixed by a software upgrade. The only thing a software update could do is bypass whatever is causing the problem, which might cause instability.

But for me, for now, I am lucky enough that it is working ok for my EVO. I hope they find the fix so everybody can stop worrying about this phone and just start enjoying it.

 

[yazman666]

Ok guys i've been off the forum quite a while since the evo launched..i was doing some testing and some comparisons...and i hate to say that i will probably give my EVO this very same week to my wife, the phone has great features and the design looks great( the light leak under the buttoms is just annoying) but the main problem i see right now is the wifi connectivity, i dont have 4g yet and i depend completly on wifi connections at home and my office and i have to say that the EVO has the worsy wifi range connection possible for a smartphone, i already update the first ota they did and keep encountering issues with the sd card not as often but i do, on top of that im not very happy with the battery life as well, ill probably try the seido 1700 but at this point im just tired of looking for solutions to fix or try to cover things that should have been addressed in the first place by the manufactures but well overall is a great phone and beautiful my wife loved it so probably ill give it to her ( she doesnt run on geek mode like me) and try the upcoming samsung galaxy s....peace

 

[Auzo]

@Auzo

Few corrections. The G1 has a TI Transceiver. Check out:

Woops, I meant to say N1. Corrected my post.

Man, gotta love iFixit! Glad to see they are independent.

 

[jrcbandit]

At the very least, all phones seem to plagued with reporting low reception, but are all EVOs actually getting poor reception on Wi-fi? I am trying to decide if it is even worth trying an exchange, as there seems to be a supply problem for new EVO's. This is reminding me of the shoddy hardware launch of the Pre/supply constraints and we know how that turned out (I ended up getting worse Pre's when I tried 2 exchanges).

I know some people have posted that the phone shows lower reception but they are still getting fast data. How far away are you guys going? Two rooms away my phone still works, but if I go downstairs + 2 rooms away then the signal shows 0 bars (just the single dot), -85 to - 95 dBm instead of the -68 to -78 that both my Pre and laptop can get (download Wi-fi analyzer), and the data is very flaky/times out.

 

[dfine1966]

I still must be in the minority. I just used wifi analyzer and in the room with the router, I am getting 40 dbm. I live in a Colonial, 2 story, and all the way at the other end of the house I get about 75 dbm. The router is towards the back of the house on the top floor. I just went out to get the mail at my mailbox and I was getting 1 bar around 95 dbm and I am picking up a few of my neighbors signals. I got my EVO day one at Sprint Corp store in Connecticut. At least this is not like when I got a Palm Pre, when I had to get 5 phones until one actually worked correctly.

Again, I would be interested in knowing what people are using for routers to see if the ones who are or aren't having problems have anything in common. I am using a Netgear WNDR 3700.

 

[RayStinkle]

where exactly is the wifi antenna location? i couldnt tell from the teardown pics. is it possible its in a bad spot where your hand holding the phone blocks the reception?

 

[Auzo]

in step 13, do you see the two pressure contacts to the right of the chip (gold colored). So if you are looking at the back cover it would be on the bottom right.

Ya your palm will do a good job covering it there.

 

[Yourdogsdead]

Does anyone know if the kickstand is metal? Perhaps it's interfering with it.

 

[Android Believer]

I just got off of the phone with htc Tech Support and was told that they are fully aware of the problem and are working on a solution. I was also told that they believe it's a software problem and sometime soon people will be receiving a software update over the air. I then asked for a potential timeline and was not given one.

 

[markdek]

Does anyone know if the kickstand is metal? Perhaps it's interfering with it.

That would be ironic, and a tragedy.....lol

 

[eyecon82]

I am sick and tired of HTC and Sprint doing nothing about this. This is definitely a pandemic (well not really global since Evo's are only in USA) issue

here are all the emails of HTC executives courtesy of consumerist.com. Perhaps an Executive Email Carpet Bomb can grab someones attention

Mark_Baker@htc.com Senior Director Enterprise Business Unit Americas
Cher_Wang@htc.com Chairman
John_Wang@htc.com Chief Marketing Officer, HTC Corporation
Keith_Nowak@htc.com Senior Public Relations Manager at HTC
Fred_Liu@htc.com COO of HTC
HT_Cho@htc.com Board Member of HTC
Peter_Chou@htc.com CEO
Lotus_Chan@htc.com VP HTC
Horace_Luke@htc.com Chief Innovation Officer

Sources Reach HTC Executives - The Consumerist

 

[Android Believer]

It does in fact respond to a magnet like metal, but the attraction isn't very strong at all, so it could just be platted, instead of solid metal.

 

[markdek]

This probably my last post, but I may check back, but I returned my Evo today. Went to 2 Sprint stores, reported issue, no "good" response from them, nor HTC.

By the By, I tested 4 store units and they all were plagued w/ poor wifi.....this should be enough to quiet any critics. In every instance the staff were clueless, but when I showed them the problem, they agreed that it's an issue.....this phone is just so new.

I have other issues as battery life, ROM memory (very limited), availability of future updates (Android 2.2 & > updates may not be compatible or available)....and the general lack of "rich" applications.

I think many many people will be and should be ecstatic over this Evo....it's a great unit. I had as much fun, or more, working w/ it for 5 days than I did w/ my iPhone. The open source Android platform is the way to go. Unfortunately, per usual, it's the "Carriers" that tend to screw things up w/ demanding hardware limits/changes from the manufacturers, bloat-ware, hidden costs, etc.

Hang in there guys, I'll bet Htc fixes this.

 

[eyecon82]

This probably my last post, but I may check back, but I returned my Evo today. When to 2 Sprint stores, reported issue, no "good" response from them, nor HTC.

By the By, I tested 4 store units and they all were plagued w/ poor wifi.....this should be enough to quite any critics. In every instance the staff were clueless, but when I showed them the problem, they agreed that it's an issue.....this phone is just so new.

I have other issues as battery life, ROM memory (very limited), availability of future updates (Android 2.2 & > updates may not be compatible or available)....and the general lack of "rich" applications.

I think many many people will be and should be ecstatic over this Evo....it's a great unit. I had as much fun, or more working w/ it for 5 days. The open source Android platform is the way to go. Unfortunately, per usual, it's the "Carriers" that tend to screw things up w/ demanding hardware limits/changes, bloat-ware, etc.

Hand in there guys, I'll bet Htc fixes this.

if you educated yourself a few hours on how to root your device at XDA, you will know that you could fix all of the issues you were just complaining about.

 

[markdek]

I'm not interested in Rooting on the Android, as I was also not interest in hacking the iPhone. To each his own.

 

[eyecon82]

ok...just letting you know that was an option...it's very painless

 

[markdek]

Yeah @eyecon82, I'm pretty geeky and love research, digging deep, and tweeking, but I have not crossed that fine line into messing around w/ the ROM. I'll tell ya I've learned alot about Android in the past few days. I did run Ubuntu for a couple years.

As far as Android phones (and maybe Pads?), it's too bad Google didn't keep control of their development....The Nexus One seems to have been a remarkable leep. Unfortunately now the Big Carriers are getting involved, and that's not good. I'm not sure the carriers care about the Android enthusiasts; they are more interested in the bottom line....money. Kudos to HTC though.

I understand the Android phone enough that when I saw that the available ROM was only 427mb, I was dissapointed. I know I know about 2.2 that's coming, but we don't know how it's going to be implemented on specific phones. Lots of ROM would have been nice for some Big apps.........