Bad Wi-Fi Range

[Darth Mo]

Meow! Could it be that those 15 people have defective phones or is that too unlikely to happen considering there were thousands of units sold and this is one of the most populated forums about it?

All I'm saying is that it might not be an issue with ALL EVOs... sowy!

No worries, you're just like the tenth person to insist that it's a reporting error when that was essentially ruled out through trial and error. I know it's a long thread, but it's kind of annoying.

Right now, it's one of the following:

Weak radio/antenna: possible as everyone, even those that aren't experiencing much of a performance decrease in data transfer still report lower WiFi signal than other devices

Defective units: Always a possibility

Software issue: incompatibility with certain routers

Maybe this will help. Everyone post the performance you're getting and what router you're using and it's setting (B+G, B/G/N, etc) and maybe we can find a correlation.

Buffalo WHR-HP-G54 router, G only, WEP64 getting weak signal and terrible throughput.

 

[thekarens]

I'm also having a problem with it, but thankfully I get 4g at home. Normally when I get home I switch to WiFi, but with this issue I've just been switching to 4g at home instead of WiFi.

 

[evousertrin]

All,
I read just about every comment on here regarding wifi issues, which I was having as well.
I could literally place the phone on my d-link and showed excellent strength. It would attempt to connect, but never did.

Decided to download an app......
Don't know if I got lucky or what, but downloaded free app Wifi Buddy from within the Market tool. Installed and the darn thing is actually working fine. You guys/gals might give it a try. It worked for me.
The battery still &(*&(*& though.

TC

 

[jrcbandit]

It isn't just a display problem for me, either. When in my kitchen, my Pre and laptop work flawlessly. With the Evo, it has 0 bars and it constantly pauses/times out. Similarly at work, my Pre and laptop connect (signal isnt that strong but still works perfectly fine), while my EVO can't even see the wireless network half the time depending on my location and it almost never connects properly.

At work, my laptop gets -67 to -78 dBm while the EVO only gets -88 to -98 dBm.

 

[akarol]

Bottom line, is it a possibility to enable the N-band in our wireless cards? I know it's there, as it is the case with the Nexus One. But how come it isn't enabled.

 

[jlawou]

I took my phone into a Sprint repair center today and they said the wireless antenna was bad. I will be getting another Evo when they get more stock in. Hopefully that antenna is not junk either.

 

[tdubby#AC]

from what I've seen my wifi range is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than my ipod touch.. I was lucky to get my ipod touch to join ..No issues with my evo.

 

[Darth Mo]

Finally found an app that gives WiFi signal in dBm. Reception is uniform in general over distance, but fluctuates wildly when stationary (+/9 dBm, not good as that means you can go from work to not work sitting in the same position). The readings were taken at 0, 8, 16, and 32 ft, all taken in line of sight to avoid discrepancies. A ~-77 dBm signal at 32 ft means that with a clear line of sight, the Evo should will go under a -94 dB signal over 100 ft. Problem is most of us don't live in the middle of an empty warehouse. Throw a couple walls in the way and the 100 ft drops to around 30 ft.

Can this be fixed via software? Possibly if there's room to boost power to the receiver amp (yay, more power consumption) and tweak the overhead. I'm wondering if the same EM interference that's making the touchscreen go wonky on certain surfaces is also affecting the WiFi at lower signals.

I guess we wait.

 

[Auzo]

I took my phone into a Sprint repair center today and they said the wireless antenna was bad. I will be getting another Evo when they get more stock in. Hopefully that antenna is not junk either.

Interesting, could you elaborate? Did they disassemble your phone and see some physical indicator that your antenna was bad?

Also are all sprint stores considered repair centers?

 

[Darth Mo]

Interesting, could you elaborate? Did they disassemble your phone and see some physical indicator that your antenna was bad?

Also are all sprint stores considered repair centers?

They probably just ran a couple tests and decided it was bad. They don't work on phones like that.

All Sprint stores are not repair centers. In fact, the majority aren't, you can find out on the website.

 

[steverath44]

I too am having a problem with Wifi. Using a D-Link 655 Extreme N Gigabit Router. When near the router I get great signal and great download speeds. Walk as little as 12 feet and signal drops significantly and download speed drops. I just called HTC and they said they haven't heard much about this... typical. I asked it they read their own forums... In fact I tried to post in their HTC Support Forum and it wouldn't allow me... kept switching me to another page (and I was logged in)... The rep eventually said it could be a bad Wifi antenna. Need to get it repaired. Suggested either HTC service center in TX or a local Sprint repair center. I'm opting for Sprint repair center and hopefully they can fix it while I wait. I love this phone so far and BUT need the Wifi capability as 4G reception is weak in my part of town.

 

[ambulanceonfire]

sprint doesn't do much of anything. they test it for what you say is wrong. if its broken they give you a new one and ship the old one off to HTC as its still obviously under warranty.

 

[anon(19803)]

I definitely have wifi signal issues. We have a Linksys wireless N router with rangemax and places that my Pre can get 1/4 bars my Evo has to connect to 3G. Here's hoping HTC will recognize this and fix it!

 

[digmys]

Have you guys tried downloading WiFi Analyzer? I just did and it is showing signal levels nearly identical to if not better than my laptop. This confirms for me that it is a software issue and HTC made it so you couldnt connect to networks with a low signal in order to save on battery.

If a signal is low, wifi, 3g, 4g whatever, your phone has to transmit at a rate inversely proportional to the signal it is receiving. Example, if you are receiving -50dB your phone would have to transmit at 50dB for it to reach the router/tower.

That being said HTC probably just made a software restriction so that you cannot connect if the signal level is -90dB (made up number) or lower so that your phone is not transmitting at 90dB+ in order to reach the router and killing your battery.

If any of this is true, it should NOT in ANY WAY cause negative wifi performance when connected, it may however kick you off of a weaker network or not let you connect to a weak network, the issues that most of us are seeing.

 

[dcgrand]

OK guys I think I know what the root cause it.

It looks like the main culprit is the Broadcom WiFi, Bluetooth and FM combo chip. Why I say this? because its not just the EVO but the nexxus one, the ipad, the ipod touch that use it. And guess what? All of them have wifi issues. Of course not each and every single unit produced but a reasonable number and hence it has showed up in the forums.

Recall the comic moment in the latest Apple keynote, when Steve Jobs couldn't connect his shiny iPhone to wifi. Wanna guess which wifi chip is in the new iPhone? you guessed it right its the Broadcom wifi chip.

Now here is my hypothesis. There can be a few reasons for the failure:

1. Incompatibility between the Broadcom wifi chip and some routers. I believe this to be the most likely cause. Because many people have noted that changing the router has indeed solved the issue. So if you guys want to try it, try getting a router that has a Broadcom chip in it too. Linksys exclusively uses Broadcom chips. Also Buffalo (I think owned by linksys) also uses Broadcom chips. Also try upgrading your existing routers firmware first. Now the question is, can this be fixed by a software update? Maybe if Broadcom figures out what the issue is. In my opinion changing the router is only a short term fix because if I am sitting in say Starbucks or in my office and they happen to have a router that is incompatible, then I am out of luck because they are not going to change their router for me lol.

2. Some recent batches of the Broadcom chips are defective. This is quite possible although not very likely. Working in the RF semiconductor industry myself I know each chip is tested pretty extensively through a suite of tests before being sold to say HTC or Apple in this case. Unless Broadcom changed or trimmed their test suite to save test time (hence money) and some faulty units which are not otherwise completely bad are getting through. Now you might ask why would Broadcom try to trim testing time to save money? well as a design engineer I know that our customers usually demand from us to drop our price every year. Now unless you do a redesign and shrink the size of the chip itself there are not many ways to drop price. Increasing efficiency in manufacturing and production is the only way left. And trimming testing time is part of increasing efficiency.

3. The antenna is bad or not seated properly in some units. This is probably the least likely cause in my opinion. Because we are seeing this issue among different manufacturers like Apple and HTC. Unless of course both of them use the same assembly house, which is also possible.

So what would I do if I have wifi issues? I would do a firmware on my router and if that fails I would check it with a linksys router. If either of these fix the issue then I would hang on for a software update. If not I would try to exchange it or return it because that might indicate an hardware issue.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you guys have any comments, suggestions or questions. Again this is an educated guess on my part. I haven't done any exhaustive testing or analysis.

 

[dcgrand]

@modplan

LOL sorry but this has to be funniest post I have read. This is going on my works notice board. Please research a little before posting.

First of all the Rx sensitivity power levels are reported in dBm. I am guessing the Broadcom chip receiver sensitivity is about -90dBm i.e 1e-9 mW. Now according to you the transmit power should be 90dBm in this case. LOL you know how much power that is??? That is 1000000 WATTS !!!! If anyone can figure out how to generate that much power from a 3-4 volt battery (impossible) he/she will be GOD and most importantly it will fry you brain in an instant

Have you guys tried downloading WiFi Analyzer? I just did and it is showing signal levels nearly identical to if not better than my laptop. This confirms for me that it is a software issue and HTC made it so you couldnt connect to networks with a low signal in order to save on battery.

If a signal is low, wifi, 3g, 4g whatever, your phone has to transmit at a rate inversely proportional to the signal it is receiving. Example, if you are receiving -50dB your phone would have to transmit at 50dB for it to reach the router/tower.

That being said HTC probably just made a software restriction so that you cannot connect if the signal level is -90dB (made up number) or lower so that your phone is not transmitting at 90dB+ in order to reach the router and killing your battery.

If any of this is true, it should NOT in ANY WAY cause negative wifi performance when connected, it may however kick you off of a weaker network or not let you connect to a weak network, the issues that most of us are seeing.

 

[ctwilliams]

fwiw: I waited the hour or whatever and talked to HTC support. They said they are well aware of the issue and asked that people call them and report it to them in addition to anything else they do. They took down the serial number of the phone to compare with others.

866-449-8358 7 days a week 6am - 1am EST

Just be sure to have a speakerphone and plan to wait awhile...

 

[Auzo]

@modplan

LOL sorry but this has to be funniest post I have read. This is going on my works notice board. Please research a little before posting.

First of all the Rx sensitivity power levels are reported in dBm. I am guessing the Broadcom chip receiver sensitivity is about -90dBm i.e 1e-9 mW. Now according to you the transmit power should be 90dBm in this case. LOL you know how much power that is??? That is 1000000 WATTS !!!! If anyone can figure out how to generate that much power from a 3-4 volt battery (impossible) he/she will be GOD and most importantly it will fry you brain in an instant

Whoa, relax.

First of all while you are right the sensitivity power is reported in dBm, he stated values in dB which is a relative number (gain or amplification, its diminesionless) not absolute power like dBm or dBW. Secondly he said it was a made up number because he was only using it to make a point.

Also while not practical you could make a large enough battery that had only 4V but had the capacity to deliver enough current to create 1000000 Watts. Power = Voltage x Current (basic physics) 250000A is a crap load but its not impossible as you state. Voltage (potential energy) alone doesn't limit power.

In the end his point was about how the EVO compared relative to his laptop, so IMO his theory could still be valid.

Not everyone is an engineer so they may not know all the terminology in and out and thats fine they can't all be cool like us but its one thing to try to constructively add to his post with some corrections but quite another to call him out like you did.

BTW I am an RF Comm Engineer.

 

[markdek]

@dcgrand .....your Linksys theory doesn't work for me. I've studied and "tested" this issue to death (and the short battery life too). I've done testing on Linksys routers. Fact is for me, signal strengths are ~15db (or dbm) lower on the Evo wifi than any other wifi hardware I could get my hands on to test. Also, transfer speeds at equivalent distances are less on the Evo. The Evo also reaches a distance, which varies depending on walls, etc., where the connection is either lost or cannot be made; and that distance is much much short than all the other hardware tested.

I can't comment on the iPad issue...I didn't follow it as I don't own one....and I don't care, as this is HTC's issue.

The poor wifi connectively issue that concerns me the most is overall lower file transfer speeds, additional wasted power, inability to connect to, or connect at sufficient speeds @ public APs, like coffee shops, and also work, home, etc. I do not want to transfer videos music, and other large file via wifi @ 11Mbps, if I should be getting 54Mbps. I also want to connect to APs that are more than 15 to 25 feet away, as needed.

This is especially important too as, who knows, Sprint may add bandwidth limits sometime, and we may want to defer to the wifi for it's bandwidth to our cable broadband connection.

 

[dcgrand]

@ Auzo

LOL I know I shouldn't have done that but just wanted to make a point that people should research a little before posting. I apologize for my rudeness.

Haha yea its THEORETICALLY possible. But I was talking more in terms of practicality. And we are talking about a phone here so keeping the size in perspective.

His theory could be valid in the sense that the phone is deliberately choosing say 3g or 4g over WiFi and putting the WiFi transceiver in some kinda of idle or low power mode. But I doubt that's the case because I think firstly HTC has acknowledged the issue and many are reporting intermittent drop in connection too. Also this has been an issue on the ipad too which are WiFi only at the moment I believe. Hope they fix this issue soon and I hope its not hardware related.

BTW I am an RF Design engineer and I design WLAN PA's

Whoa, relax.

First of all while you are right the sensitivity power is reported in dBm, he stated values in dB which is a relative number (gain or amplification, its diminesionless) not absolute power like dBm or dBW. Secondly he said it was a made up number because he was only using it to make a point.

Also while not practical you could make a large enough battery that had only 4V but had the capacity to deliver enough current to create 1000000 Watts. Power = Voltage x Current (basic physics) 250000A is a crap load but its not impossible as you state. Voltage (potential energy) alone doesn't limit power.

In the end his point was about how the EVO compared relative to his laptop, so IMO his theory could still be valid.

Not everyone is an engineer so they may not know all the terminology in and out and thats fine they can't all be cool like us but its one thing to try to constructively add to his post with some corrections but quite another to call him out like you did.

BTW I am an RF Comm Engineer.