Future of LG and removable batteries

[Aquila]

Out of curiosity, where are you getting your 1%, 0.3% numbers from?

Cross section of LG G5 and LG V20 customers who purchased the device for no reason except for the removable battery and who, even with education about reasonable alternatives could not get by with those alternatives. So LGs market share reduced to encompass only the most sincere removable battery dependant consumers who actually make it a single feature purchase decision. The matter is as opposed to the vast majority of consumers who make decisions based on several components and the overall user experience.

 

[Aquila]

From my own observations, you are doing exactly what you said we shouldn't be doing: weighing the pros/cons from behind the veil of your own biases.

I'd have to agree to disagree here. If you read it carefully, I've been asking the pro crowd to do two things: 1 clearly define their own position in terms of pros and cons and 2 try to imagine what they think an opposing argument might consist of. Those two things were asked due to reasons that were explained a few posts ago, but it basically boils down to each side being able to clearly understand the opposition's position. As an example, your post addressed several topics that I and others brought up, but it does not actually address my points despite being addressed to me. So while I can see you think I am arguing unfairly, I think that you may be looking at my methods for pushing back in the misrepresentation of argument, rather than on the actual argument itself.

I do like the way you presented the Note 7 argument. I don't agree that more space would have prevented the battery failures, but it is definitely a valid line of reasoning. The only reason I disagree is because it seems like Samsung's final explanation rested entirely on two defects, one each, to the two waves of batteries and they did not shift the blame to the Samsung engineers who designed the space within which the battery would be housed. That said, in December your hypothesis was one of those being discussed and it seemed like an extremely plausible explanation because it had the ability to explain how two sets of batteries were compromised. But the official explanation also accomplished that, so I'm inclined to rest in they barring additional information.

 

[delta7]

Aren't sealed battery phones a little sleeker than non sealed battery phones?

Also imagine using kitkat today? Do you really want to keep a skinned android phone for anything over two years? You got people whining still over lag on the s7 imagine using a s4?

I think LG is just trying to be more competitive and yes Imo you do t need a removable battery but I the issue with LG is not as good screen, Qualigy control issues aka failing phones, confusing software and can't get out of being compared to Samsung.

 

[LeoRex]

Also imagine using kitkat today? Do you really want to keep a skinned android phone for anything over two years? You got people whining still over lag on the s7 imagine using a s4?

Well, I think you do touch on an very important point here... The amount of time that the average phone's battery starts to degrade to the point where it starts to become unusable is also very close to the average time people hold on to their phones. Yes, I understand that 'my battery is junk' is a fairly popular excuse people will give when they get a new phone, but there are tons of places that will replace batteries in sealed phones....

The tech is starting to slow down, each generation of phone is less and less superior to the previous one. Once we get to the point where a phone can last 4 or 5 years and still be viable, then we might start to see fewer phones that are a pain to swap out.

 

[flyingkytez]

I'm sure LG workers and engineers are reading this forum. I don't see why not since it's public. Hopefully they can see that a lot of us enjoy the removable batteries.

 

[Aquila]

I'm sure LG workers and engineers are reading this forum. I don't see why not since it's public. Hopefully they can see that a lot of us enjoy the removable batteries.

Not sure about LG, but I do know that a number of companies do pay particular attention to AC's forums and the comments of some other tech blogs.

 

[skeptic25]

Whether they read the forums or not doesn't matter in the removable battery debate. Niche markets are by definition small. Even if 5% of the market demanded removable batteries it wouldn't be an effective chase for LG. With phones more and more becoming similar, the play would be marketing. Years ago that's what Samsung did. Throw boatloads of cash into the marketing department, sit back, then throw boatloads more.

 

[flyingkytez]

Whether they read the forums or not doesn't matter in the removable battery debate. Niche markets are by definition small. Even if 5% of the market demanded removable batteries it wouldn't be an effective chase for LG. With phones more and more becoming similar, the play would be marketing. Years ago that's what Samsung did. Throw boatloads of cash into the marketing department, sit back, then throw boatloads more.

They're going the Samsung route: make the phone pretty. Sealed phones do look a bit nicer because they're unibody (the HTC 10 for example). And also the bezeless phone trend might be just a fad. I had a Samsung Tab S 8.4 and the bezels were thin. However it was very uncomfortable to hold and use due to minimal bezels so I got rid of it (plus the battery was terrible). We'll see how it goes once it arrives.

 

[TNCattleDog]

There will NEVER be a "perfect" phone...it's what keeps us buying new "better phones". That's the sales model of the industry.

That said, I prefer removable batteries. I am a power user and I don't have time to plug in during my (long) daily routine. Even with Fast Charge, it simply doesn't work with the way I do. Especially when it takes me less than two minutes to swap out batteries from start to finish. And, a spare battery is much less cumbersome than a charger and a cable.

In addition, all phones SHOULD be water resistant; or at the very least, the flagships should. It is not impossible to make a phone with a removable battery water resistant too. To have a slimmer phone you need a sealed battery? I think not... the V20 is an incredibly slim phone. To have high quality materials you need a sealed phone? Again, I think not. The V20 is a solidly built phone, even with a removable back plate and battery. Also, I am not a fan of "premium glass frames". Its a gimmick and will fracture with the first or second drop. IMHO, they are crap. It's all marketing that OEM's want you to think make it a better phone. Frankly, not.

How many of you have hidden that "premium build" in a case? To protect it or to give it that custom feel?

IMHO, the V20 is a slim, sexy, well built phone with a "premium build", great screen, excellent sound quality, and decent battery life. (excellent, if you consider the ability to quickly swap out with a fully charged battery). Oh, and removable storage as well.

Steps off soapbox...

David

 

[Aquila]

I agree glass bodies = bad plan

 

[Ry]

I'm sure LG workers and engineers are reading this forum. I don't see why not since it's public. Hopefully they can see that a lot of us enjoy the removable batteries.

That's fine.

But if their own data shows things like people not buying extra batteries or people not swapping batteries, it may not be that important.

 

[flyingkytez]

That's fine.

But if their own data shows things like people not buying extra batteries or people not swapping batteries, it may not be that important.

Their next data: current V20 owners leaving and or switching to Samsung. I think I'm gonna go back to Samsung if LG ends up sealing their batteries. Samsung makes excellent phones, they're known to have the best screens period (they pretty much dominate the smartphone screen industry). Plus they have better features (Samsung Pay). Unless LG can top Samsung in quality and features, there's no point in staying with LG (need a good reason to).

 

[monsieurms]

Love how people just complain and make it impossible for the manufacture to win. No removable battery? I guess they lose a customer. No waterproofing? Lose customers. No wireless charging? Lose customers. Build an incredible phone with all the features people whine about but charge $1000? Lose customers. Being a bike messenger is about the only job I can think of that keeps you away from a charger all day. I don't get how you guys go through hours of battery use but can't charge your phone.

Well, I've said this before. But people have different needs and patterns. Do I mostly need a removable battery? No. Could I sometimes bring a charger instead (more inconvenient, cables, requires time), yes, although not nearly as good a solution. Could I bring an external charger? Sometimes. But the ones I own are a lot bigger and of course they require a cable. You can't use the phone much while you're charging.

And then I travel a lot. So, I'm not a bike messenger, but even so there are circumstances where charging all the time is inconvenient and sometimes impossible. Let's see. In Paris this summer, I'm walking around on a bright sunny day. The screen is turned all the way up. Using Google Maps. Using the camera a lot. I go into a museum--still using the camera a lot. Checking the digital guidebook. I sit down for lunch at an outdoor cafe, listening to music, reading a book, editing the photos on Aviary, surfing the 'net (yay for T-mobile's international roaming data). Using French apps for things like metro info, SNCF info. Etc. I'd be into the low teens by 2 pm. At that point, I couldn't risk using the phone much more. Couldn't even get through a 9-5 day on a Note 4. I switched to an Anker double capacity battery (6400). That would get me to 5 pm, but not much more. (And I had no good case for it, which makes me nervous when I'm walking aimlessly around.)

Or, to quote your username, , with a removable battery you can just do what you want and not worry about it. How is that a bad thing?

There's no quicker, more convenient or easier solution than a removable battery. And if this had not had one, I would've waited to see what the Note 8 was like. And LG might indeed have lost the sale, since my normal inertia makes me lean to the same ecosystem.

Aren't sealed battery phones a little sleeker than non sealed battery phones?
.

No. For one thing, I use a sturdy case. How could I tell how sleek it is? In any event, function not form is what it is important to me.

 

[datum9]

Well, I've said this before. But people have different needs and patterns. Do I mostly need a removable battery? No. Could I sometimes bring a charger instead (more inconvenient, cables, requires time), yes, although not nearly as good a solution. Could I bring an external charger? Sometimes. But the ones I own are a lot bigger and of course they require a cable. You can't use the phone much while you're charging.

And then I travel a lot. So, I'm not a bike messenger, but even so there are circumstances where charging all the time is inconvenient and sometimes impossible. Let's see. In Paris this summer, I'm walking around on a bright sunny day. The screen is turned all the way up. Using Google Maps. Using the camera a lot. I go into a museum--still using the camera a lot. Checking the digital guidebook. I sit down for lunch at an outdoor cafe, listening to music, reading a book, editing the photos on Aviary, surfing the 'net (yay for T-mobile's international roaming data). Using French apps for things like metro info, SNCF info. Etc. I'd be into the low teens by 2 pm. At that point, I couldn't risk using the phone much more. Couldn't even get through a 9-5 day on a Note 4. I switched to an Anker double capacity battery (6400). That would get me to 5 pm, but not much more. (And I had no good case for it, which makes me nervous when I'm walking aimlessly around.)

Or, to quote your username, , with a removable battery you can just do what you want and not worry about it. How is that a bad thing?

There's no quicker, more convenient or easier solution than a removable battery. And if this had not had one, I would've waited to see what the Note 8 was like. And LG might indeed have lost the sale, since my normal inertia makes me lean to the same ecosystem.



No. For one thing, I use a sturdy case. How could I tell how sleek it is? In any event, function not form is what it is important to me.

These are good points.

I can think of many instances when charging is not possible.

When you travel to a European airport and bring the charger but realize they use 220V system not 110V and none of the plugs fit. So you have to buy one of these converters hoping a store is open and if it's 2AM.. guess what, they are not. So you deal with downtime.

If you are driving in your car and a fuse blows. No charging, none of the 12V outlets work. Or your chargers breaks, a lot of these things are awfully fragile.

There are many instances where it's convenient to pop open a cover, insert a fresh battery and keep going. Either stock capacity cell or an oversized one. Then back at hotel, recharge the depleted batteries.

 

[monsieurms]

Then back at hotel, recharge the depleted batteries.

Yes, the ability to recharge the run down battery in a separate travel charger is invaluable multi-tasking. You get a fresh battery when you get back. IN the meantime, you're up and running with the new one you popped in.

 

[datum9]

precisely

 

[SupraLB]

I have never used a spare battery. Its no importance to me.

However, I am looking at doing some long mountain hikes this spring. Debating if to buy a spare battery, or 2nd larger battery cell (that anyone could tap into if needed).

 

[Mike Dee]

I have never used a spare battery. Its no importance to me.

However, I am looking at doing some long mountain hikes this spring. Debating if to buy a spare battery, or 2nd larger battery cell (that anyone could tap into if needed).

Get the Zerolemon or Hyperion extended batteries

 

[monsieurms]

I have never used a spare battery. Its no importance to me.

However, I am looking at doing some long mountain hikes this spring. Debating if to buy a spare battery, or 2nd larger battery cell (that anyone could tap into if needed).

Depends on how much juice you need. I have 2 spare batteries. And a battery pack. They serve different purposes and the batteries are very light. But for what you mention, I think a battery pack is a good idea. (But remember...when you're charging it's hard to use the phone...that's where the extra battery comes in.)

The bigger battery packs have become remarkably compact and can give you a ton of juice in a fairly small form. Here's the Anker that I use. What I like about it:
--relatively small for its capacity
-- Supports QC 3.0 quick charge.
--Quality company.

Anker PowerCore 20000

There is a 26,000 now, too, I believe. That is right at the limit of what airlines allow, so since I travel a lot, I decided not to push that issue, even if I am currently in the right. And of course they have some things that are more along the lines of emergency power that have a ton of capacity--but that likely won't be something you want to carry around while hiking.

 

[Mooncatt]

If I were going to be out in the wilderness for an extended time, I'd look into the solar powered battery banks. That way you can hang it on your backpack while hiking, biking, etc. to recharge it as needed. Otherwise, I'd just go with one or two extended phone batteries, depending on my stay.