HTC profits smacked due to delay

[lou61166]

My GS3 to GS4 comment was not meant to minimize any improvements that undoubtedly exist between the two. What I meant is that a quick look at the two phones doesn't show much difference.

The One, on the other hand, has a look and feel that separates it from other HTC phones (and other phones in general). Beyond that, I think that the camera, Zoe mode, Blinkfeed, and the loud, front-facing speakers are easy talking points which set the One apart from the competition.

Until i see the S4 display put the screen on your list also,as neither the S3 or the Note 2 screens can compare to my DNA,and the one has the same screen a little smaller.

 

[indomie]

What?

I think what he's saying is that nothing in the future is definite. We can wring our hands and fret about whether or not HTC is going to be around in six months. In the meantime, some major global event (ex. North Korea going nuclear against S Korea or Japan) could change the world completely. No more S Korea = no more Samsung, though I doubt that will be on anyone's mind if NK goes nuclear.

 

[indomie]

So if we assume that the one ships, sells well, has no major hiccups technically and htc makes enough money to make a follow-up to the one. What should that phone look like? You can't re invent the wheel every few months with a totally revamped design (that was htc's past strategy). They made the one different to disassociate it with past failures

Sent from my Note 2

That's a really interesting and good question. Provided your scenario holds true, I would think that the follow-up would be a fine tuning rather than a radical revision. Does aluminium body work? If so, they use it again but perhaps using an even stronger composition. I think front-facing speakers are here to stay. I think as processor speed increases, they can increase the resolution of the camera while retaining (or improving) the low-light performance. Those are a few things that come to mind...

Samsung hit it out of the park with the Galaxy S3, so the S4 is a fine tuning rather than a total do-over or new invention. As you said, why reinvent the wheel if you've already done it right? Apple has had enormous success with its iPhones, so they are never really that different from the model they're replacing. If HTC has done it right with the One, this may be the basis for future HTC revisions/updates. Going back to my original comment, what I meant was that HTC needed something radically different to have the hope of being noticed & surviving. It wasn't meant as a slight against Samsung...

I can't really speak much to HTC's past failures. They clearly did something (or many things) very wrong in 2012. I tend not to follow phone tech trends until I'm approaching the end of a two-year contract & ready to buy a new phone, so I was both surprised and confused to learn how quickly they had fallen over the course of one year. From personal experience, though, I've always been happy with the build quality and software of my HTC phones. I would not classify any of my HTC phones as a failure.

 

[Suda]

I think what he's saying is that nothing in the future is definite. We can wring our hands and fret about whether or not HTC is going to be around in six months. In the meantime, some major global event (ex. North Korea going nuclear against S Korea or Japan) could change the world completely. No more S Korea = no more Samsung, though I doubt that will be on anyone's mind if NK goes nuclear.

No I mean I get it, I just don't see what that has to do with this and is pretty miniscule when taking into consideration of that situation. Even if they did go to war, no one would to stop buying Samsung phones because of it. I don't think anything will come of all this. But if something did at least it wasn't something Samsung could control, nuking them would be about the only way they'd stop making money. But If not just one person, I'm sure someone at HTC at some point in time saw things were south quickly. Yet they still put out 13 phones just last year alone, the J Butterfly/DNA and One X being the only two I'm sure that put some kind of profit in their pockets. And both were carrier exclusives.

 

[acrewdog]

Well, it might not be something that Samsung can control but neither was the shortage of chips that lead to HTC releasing the One late.

HTC was definitely on the wrong path putting out carrier exclusives and struggled to update so many different models of phone. HTC missed the mark with it's marketing and did a poor job of getting the in-store salespeople on their side, things that Samsung did very well. They did however, produce phones that got rave reviews.
Just two years ago when I bought my last phone I was coming off of a Samsung phone that got a total of ONE update the entire time I had it. At the time Samsung was known for a lack of updates and dropping models relatively quickly.

Things change, companies learn from each other. Like I said, many companies operate in the red sometimes. HTC is fine. They have a blockbuster phone on their hands. Even if you don't buy it.

 

[tekhna]

Well, it might not be something that Samsung can control but neither was the shortage of chips that lead to HTC releasing the One late.

HTC was definitely on the wrong path putting out carrier exclusives and struggled to update so many different models of phone. HTC missed the mark with it's marketing and did a poor job of getting the in-store salespeople on their side, things that Samsung did very well. They did however, produce phones that got rave reviews.
Just two years ago when I bought my last phone I was coming off of a Samsung phone that got a total of ONE update the entire time I had it. At the time Samsung was known for a lack of updates and dropping models relatively quickly.

Things change, companies learn from each other. Like I said, many companies operate in the red sometimes. HTC is fine. They have a blockbuster phone on their hands. Even if you don't buy it.

The chip shortage was entirely predictable, and entirely in HTC's control. 100%. Did they fail to think through the consequences of being a second-tier OEM? Apparently. Did they utterly bollocks up communication with their chip suppliers? Seems like it. Did they fail to think through using a new kind of sensor? Appears so.

 

[Suda]

Well, it might not be something that Samsung can control but neither was the shortage of chips that lead to HTC releasing the One late.

HTC was definitely on the wrong path putting out carrier exclusives and struggled to update so many different models of phone. HTC missed the mark with it's marketing and did a poor job of getting the in-store salespeople on their side, things that Samsung did very well. They did however, produce phones that got rave reviews.
Just two years ago when I bought my last phone I was coming off of a Samsung phone that got a total of ONE update the entire time I had it. At the time Samsung was known for a lack of updates and dropping models relatively quickly.

Things change, companies learn from each other. Like I said, many companies operate in the red sometimes. HTC is fine. They have a blockbuster phone on their hands. Even if you don't buy it.

But an unnamed HTC executive recently told the Journal that the company has had trouble getting components because it keeps changing its order estimates, following a drop in phone shipments. As a result, suppliers no longer consider HTC a "tier-one customer."

May or may not be chipsets, but it looks like HTC had a hand in something and that suppliers finally got fed up. I'm not even talking about this particular case with this phone, HTC doesn't have to release 13 phones a year. No manufacturer has to. And I've never heard the words "is fine" followed up in a sentence after someone or something has said to have lost $361 million. Especially in one year's time. If you think that's fine I would've loved to have seen your analysis on Palm before they went out of business.

"As the company is in the middle of a product launch, lumpy monthly numbers can easily be explained by the phasing of product ramp ups and wind down, "Bernstein analyst Pierre Ferragu said in an investor's note today, "but such a low number likely reflects a significant further loss of traction in the market."

"HTC One is facing sourcing issues related to camera parts and metal casings, already leading to delays in delivery," the analyst said. "If these issues persist, the reality of second quarter sales could be even worse."

None of this sounds like fine to me. But one thing I am curious about your opinion on, or anyone's really. How well do you think this phone is going to sell once the iPhone 5S and S4 hit the market? The average customer won't even know about this phone unless people in the know (let's say, those that participate in message board discussions) buys it and suggests it to them or an employee puts them on it.

 

[Russ Smith]

None of this sounds like fine to me. But one thing I am curious about your opinion on, or anyone's really. How well do you think this phone is going to sell once the iPhone 5S and S4 hit the market? The average customer won't even know about this phone unless people in the know (let's say, those that participate in message board discussions) buys it and suggests it to them or an employee puts them on it.

Hopefully they will sell enough to keep the company in the black and working forewards, not fussed if it beats other phones in sales or not. I got one, I'm happy

Sent from my HTC One

 

[adriandb]

Really, if you aren't on wall st., is this important? It shifted profits from one quarter to the next. Is there significance other than potential credit impact or standing with suppliers? And even on those, how significant is this?

 

[Suda]

Really, if you aren't on wall st., is this important? It shifted profits from one quarter to the next. Is there significance other than potential credit impact or standing with suppliers? And even on those, how significant is this?

I'd say it's important even to the average Joes. Usually people buy products, more namely smartphones, with the assumption that they'll be supported through updates and can be fixed if they get broken. If HTC goes out of business and no one offers to buy them out who's going to support the One then? Don't even think of trying to get it fixed if you break it, they only company that had any clue on how to possibly fix it is now out of business. And I'd say the standing with the suppliers is very significant as well, it's the reason you don't have your phone right now.

 

[adriandb]

I'd say it's important even to the average Joes. Usually people buy products, more namely smartphones, with the assumption that they'll be supported through updates and can be fixed if they get broken. If HTC goes out of business and no one offers to buy them out who's going to support the One then?.

Does anyone think that HTC going out of business is realistic?

 

[Suda]

Does anyone think that HTC going out of business is realistic?

I think they're in danger of it if they don't get their act together, I don't see how one can't. They certainly aren't operating on healthy levels and haven't been for awhile.

And this phone was meant to be them turning the ship around and getting back into the game, now let's see what happens.

 

[So Cold]

Really, if you aren't on wall st., is this important? It shifted profits from one quarter to the next. Is there significance other than potential credit impact or standing with suppliers? And even on those, how significant is this?

It's certainly something to be mindful of. Smartphones for most aren't the biggest purchase in the world but people don't like to buy products from companies that are in immediate danger of going under. Htc has been bleeding money for a while now but this is downright hemorrhaging money at this point. How can you not care?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that by no means should you not buy the one. But it's ignorant to just completely ignore this.

Sent from my Note 2

 

[adriandb]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that by no means should you not buy the one. But it's ignorant to just completely ignore this.

I'm not ignoring it, I just don't think that as the owner of a device I'll use for two years (at the absolute most) I really need to concern myself with their financial stability. It just doesn't matter to me.

If HTC files chapter 11 in the US the day I get my device I won't be happy, but it won't be the end of the world either.

 

[Suda]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that by no means should you not buy the one. But it's ignorant to just completely ignore this.

Sent from my Note 2

That's all I'm saying. That said I'm still considering this phone, but I'm not going to act like I'm not scared witless about buying this phone and the company no longer around the next day after. Based off my luck it'd probably happen.

 

[So Cold]

I'm not ignoring it, I just don't think that as the owner of a device I'll use for two years (at the absolute most) I really need to concern myself with their financial stability. It just doesn't matter to me.

If HTC files chapter 11 in the US the day I get my device I won't be happy, but it won't be the end of the world either.

And that's totally fine. But at least you know and have that information when you decide. I can see where this could make a difference for someone who keeps phones for a long time or is very on the fence about what phone to get.

Sent from my Note 2

 

[NoYankees44]

Did I miss the part where they are losing money?

Yeah lowering profits suck, but in no way mean the company is going to go under tomorrow. They would have to keep down this road for a couple more years to think about going under. They have not reported a loss yet. Just lowering profits.

Sent from my SCH-I535

 

[Suda]

Did I miss the part where they are losing money?

Yeah lowering profits suck, but in no way mean the company is going to go under tomorrow. They would have to keep down this road for a couple more years to think about going under. They have not reported a loss yet. Just lowering profits.

Sent from my SCH-I535

Tomorrow was just an exaggeration for how my luck is with things. I wonder what HTC's net worth is. Whatever it is, it's obvious it isn't what it was even a year ago.

 

[tekhna]

I think the ONE is HTCs' last chance to stay relevant in the Android space.

It is clear that HTC poured everything they have got into the ONE. If the culmination of all their efforts still doesn't translate to sales. Well, it means they are doomed to failed.

I think HTC is currently the only manufacturer that can potentially challenge Samsung's dominance in Android. If they go down, we will all be poorer for choice as a result.

Choice, isn't that what makes Android so great?

Definitely. And it'll be a real blow if HTC goes down. But after owning a Thunderbolt and a Rezound, I can't help but feel a bit of schadenfreude.

 

[JoshieMSU]

Definitely. And it'll be a real blow if HTC goes down. But after owning a Thunderbolt and a Rezound, I can't help but feel a bit of schadenfreude.

Awesome use of that. Love it!

On topic: Choice and competition is definitely important for us consumers. If HTC falls, who will come into play? Huawei? ZTE? Maybe it would be the perfect storm for Googlerola to hit the market with something awesome and leapfrog everyone else? Regardless, a market monopoly is one of the last things we consumers want/need.