Just held the HTC one in the store

[adriandb]

They don't, but they're also totally noncompliant with the android device guidelines. The guidelines state very specifically that phones can either have hardware or onscreen buttons. They also state that the menu button should not be included because it has been deprecated.

He does not get that. The fact that there shouldn't be a menu button and that apps shouldn't rely on one is something he doesn't grasp.

 

[stevedebi]

You can use multiple email addresses in one universal htc email app e.g. Gmail, hotmail, etc.

I already have that with K9 mail from the Play Store...

 

[BigDinCA]

I already have that with K9 mail from the Play Store...

Except no download is required with the One. HTC bakes it natively into Sense.

 

[stevedebi]

Except no download is required with the One. HTC bakes it natively into Sense.

Oh, I'll probably take a look at it, and since there is no SD card on the ONE, the capability to store email out on the sd card is not that important any more. That was one of the major draws for me in K9 mail.

 

[warpdrive]

He does not get that. The fact that there shouldn't be a menu button and that apps shouldn't rely on one is something he doesn't grasp.

No, I understand him and agree with him. It is YOU who doesn't understand.

Because I respect you and your thoughts, I'm going to reply to you again what my argument was and why your thoughts on the matter is flawed. Please bare with me as this is going to get very long winded....

First off, I want to make it clear as to what my argument was and was not.

My argument was that it is NOT the developers fault that the HTC One has a black bar in apps that require a menu button to be fully functional. I know that you have heard otherwise, but this is not fully true...and I'll get to this in a moment
My other argument was and still is, that the reason that the HTC One doesn't have a menu button or an micro sd card is not because they are being compliant with Google's standards, but because it is what HTC wants. Bare in mind that while on this phone alone it is compliant, it does not mean that they did so because they wanted to be compliant, and all evidence points to a design reason and not to bow down to Google.
So what is my proof of this? Based on current and future designs of 2013, HTC has more phones being made with both an sd card slot and a task switching button. (Note: htc has not used a menu button on any of their phones since 2012. So by default, if anyone says that HTC removed the menu button on the One to comply is wrong by default, as they haven't had one for over a year)
Because HTC has never been in the past, and currently is not concerned with Google and is putting more phones right now in the Asian market with sd cards and a 3rd hardware button.

So my point about compliance has to be true if they are repeatedly going to be non compliant in general about their hardware that they offer.

So again, why do I personally think that the One doesn't have a menu button? It was due to design that HTC wanted, or to be different then other OEMs. In fact, HTC has done a lot of things differntly in their phones as compared to others BECAUSE they don't want their UI to be the same as everyone else's android phone. Some good examples are, drastically different UI for task switching, having a non standard home button that now makes users learn a new tap dance in order to bring up the task switcher, up and down vs left to right app draw scrolling, different way to add or remove apps as compared to other android phones...I can go on all day.

So my point is, "IF" like you say, that HTC is doing something because they want to be uniformly like other android phones, or to comply with a standard that will also have the same benefits, then I would have to respectfully disagree based on the fact that as of last year, HTC has been doing just the opposite so that they hope to stand out and be different then other android phones.

Now let's get back to "is it a developer's fault for the black box because they didn't update thier software?". And if so, just how many apps are effected, since we were repeatedly told it is just a few....

Well, it turns out that it is a lot of apps, not a few. Most navigation apps, some games, even Facebook and Taptalk are effected. I also want to point out that while they are effected, they are all fully functional on the HTC One without any further updates needed.

Now, let's just say that I'm a part time developer who happens to work on taptalk.
Taptalk needs a functional menu in order to work. It doesn't need a hardware menu button to work, it will already work without one now with the HTC One. So since it already is fully functional now, why the "need" for an update?
Oh, to get rid of the black bar? Well clearly you didn't think things through...

If you want me to help update taptalk further, to comply with Google's standards, then now I would have no choice but to put a software menu button or a black bar that contains a menu button on the screen FOR EVERY ANDROID DEVICE. Now hundreds of android devices are effected by the black bar instead of just 2 or 3. THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT ME TO DO? Effect thousands of users, who most won't like the effect, just to comply with Google? Dude, you can't pay me enough money to ruin an app that thousands use and love all because of some standard...that I'm not even forced in any way to comply. For uniformity sake is a good reason, but this isn't Apple, this is android...the best part of android is that you don't have to comply with any request from Google. You can do exactly like what HTC has been doing and change things up or do you're own thing.

So, my point is, because with android you can do different things then what is asked, now people who use apps like taptalk or navigation apps, don't have to have a black bar on the screen if they don't want one...they just have to buy a non nexus and now a non HTC One device.

Choice is good. No choice is bad.
Personally the black bar doesn't bother me, but it clearly bothers some. But yes, HTC could have avoided this if they wanted, as nobody was twisting their arm to have this issue. Again, this is not Apple, Google does not force any OEM to comply. So IMHO the reason why the HTC One doesn't have an sd card slot and also doesn't have a menu button is because of a design choice that they made. After all, they clearly could have them if they wanted, just like the other phones that they are putting out this year.


sent with my 2 year old HTC evo3d

 

[return_0]

Long post is long

Sent from my pure Google Nexus 4 using Android Central Forums

 

[JoshieMSU]

Little more on the original topic of the thread:

I got to play with one for a decent chunk of time, today, here at MSU's corporate store. Love the feel and design of the device. The software + button layout will take some getting used to, coming from my GNex. Camera seems solid and perfectly adequate for my use, would have preferred a better software layout for it, though. Who knows, I may love it. If not, then play store has plenty of other options. The demo unit did have some manufacturing issues, that I saw, though. The notorious gap literally went from corner to corner across the top of the phone, and the bottom right corner had a pretty significant overhang + rough machining on the bottom edge. However, one of the reps was already using one for his daily driver, and it had none of such issues. So who knows? I'm pretty excited to unbox mine on friday, though.


Edit: Screen gorgeous, speakers are sick and warrant the hype they're getting. They may actually turn out to be my favorite part of the phone.

 

[BigDinCA]

My argument was that it is NOT the developers fault that the HTC One has a black bar in apps that require a menu button to be fully functional. I know that you have heard otherwise, but this is not fully true...and I'll get to this in a moment

It's funny when people are soooo wrong. The black bar is caused by one thing and one thing only - apps that haven't been updated to the Android application interface guidelines (ICS guidelines, mind you. Not JB guidelines or March 2013 guidelines) running on devices without a menu button. Here's links to help you understand:
Google's Android developers want you to say goodbye to the menu button | Android Central
Say Goodbye to the Menu Button | Android Developers Blog

My other argument was and still is, that the reason that the HTC One doesn't have a menu button or an micro sd card is not because they are being compliant with Google's standards, but because it is what HTC wants. Bare in mind that while on this phone alone it is compliant, it does not mean that they did so because they wanted to be compliant, and all evidence points to a design reason and not to bow down to Google.
So what is my proof of this? Based on current and future designs of 2013, HTC has more phones being made with both an sd card slot and a task switching button. (Note: htc has not used a menu button on any of their phones since 2012. So by default, if anyone says that HTC removed the menu button on the One to comply is wrong by default, as they haven't had one for over a year)
Because HTC has never been in the past, and currently is not concerned with Google and is putting more phones right now in the Asian market with sd cards and a 3rd hardware button.

I don't know their reasons any more than you do. A rational assumption would be that it falls inline with what Google is moving to. The reason "why" isn't of any significance. If I tell my kids to clean their room or get no allowance and my wife says they won't go to the movies with their friends, they clean it up. Does it matter why? Will you ever really know why? Nope. But it got done. So did the menu button for HTC, whatever the reasoning, and now those non-updated apps show their ugly black bar. Nobody's acting like they just removed it on the One. January 2012 is when Google started pushing "no menu button" so I don't think it's coincidental that they have been removing it since last year. Are they supposed to go backwards now? Once Samsung and other OEMs start removing the menu button I doubt you'll see them bring it back a year later. Sammy was smart, though. They knew there were still a boatload of apps that weren't updated so there's no rush to get rid of the menu button. The only device that adheres to all of Google's guidelines is the Nexus, and not even all of those would be compliant. Some more reading for you:
HTC's fix for the 'menu button issue' is welcome, but not very elegant | Android Central

In fact, HTC has done a lot of things differntly in their phones as compared to others BECAUSE they don't want their UI to be the same as everyone else's android phone. Some good examples are, drastically different UI for task switching, having a non standard home button that now makes users learn a new tap dance in order to bring up the task switcher, up and down vs left to right app draw scrolling, different way to add or remove apps as compared to other android phones...I can go on all day.

Everyone's UI is drastically different from everyone else. I don't know what this proves. Sense isn't Touchwiz isn't Motoblur isn't LG-whatever isn't Sony-whatchamacalit isn't Android. None of them look exactly like each other and none of them behave like stock Android. All of them do some things different than Android does natively. If they didn't, every device would be a Nexus. Who's lookin' for that? Not me. Give me some options.

Now let's get back to "is it a developer's fault for the black box because they didn't update thier software?". And if so, just how many apps are effected, since we were repeatedly told it is just a few....

Well, it turns out that it is a lot of apps, not a few. Most navigation apps, some games, even Facebook and Taptalk are effected. I also want to point out that while they are effected, they are all fully functional on the HTC One without any further updates needed.

Now, let's just say that I'm a part time developer who happens to work on taptalk.
Taptalk needs a functional menu in order to work. It doesn't need a hardware menu button to work, it will already work without one now with the HTC One. So since it already is fully functional now, why the "need" for an update?
Oh, to get rid of the black bar? Well clearly you didn't think things through...

If you want me to help update taptalk further, to comply with Google's standards, then now I would have no choice but to put a software menu button or a black bar that contains a menu button on the screen FOR EVERY ANDROID DEVICE. Now hundreds of android devices are effected by the black bar instead of just 2 or 3. THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT ME TO DO? Effect thousands of users, who most won't like the effect, just to comply with Google? Dude, you can't pay me enough money to ruin an app that thousands use and love all because of some standard...that I'm not even forced in any way to comply. For uniformity sake is a good reason, but this isn't Apple, this is android...the best part of android is that you don't have to comply with any request from Google. You can do exactly like what HTC has been doing and change things up or do you're own thing.

Who said it was just a few apps? And tapatalk is a bad example for you to use. Read their support forums and you will see the guys that make the app discussing the issues regarding their app not being ICS-and-up compliant. I do understand the small shop coding apps isn't looking to update it to ICS standards because they are small. But Facebook? Amazon? ESPN? Twitter? Are you going to use that same argument there as well? Give me a break. Now don't get me wrong: like you, I could care less about the black bar myself. But to say that it's HTCs fault is skewing the facts, and I'm putting that nicely. If they left the menu button on the device it wouldn't be an issue, that is 100% true. So that was their decision, but it wasn't because they didn't like the button, or wanted to plant pretty flowers in it's place. They're just moving in the general direction Google wants. And being the general direction that Google is guiding Android to, they also updated the interface guidelines to match. Whatever you "know" their reasoning to be doesn't change the fact that apps that are properly updated will not display that menu bar on ANY phone, including future phones that also won't have the menu button. HTC didn't design the core Android software. That menu overflow functionality is a pure Android function, and a good one at that.

 

[americasteam]

Can the Op please change the thread title to - Just saw the black bar on the HTC One because there's no hardware menu button.

Sent from my LG-E970 using Tapatalk 2

 

[scorpiodsu]

I forgot what this thread was originally about.

Sent from my LG-P769 using Android Central Forums

 

[BigDinCA]

I forgot what this thread was originally about.

The black menu bar.

 

[scorpiodsu]

The black menu bar.

Yeah now it is lol.

Sent from my LG-P769 using Android Central Forums

 

[JHBThree]

No, I understand him and agree with him. It is YOU who doesn't understand.

Because I respect you and your thoughts, I'm going to reply to you again what my argument was and why your thoughts on the matter is flawed. Please bare with me as this is going to get very long winded....

First off, I want to make it clear as to what my argument was and was not.

My argument was that it is NOT the developers fault that the HTC One has a black bar in apps that require a menu button to be fully functional. I know that you have heard otherwise, but this is not fully true...and I'll get to this in a moment
My other argument was and still is, that the reason that the HTC One doesn't have a menu button or an micro sd card is not because they are being compliant with Google's standards, but because it is what HTC wants. Bare in mind that while on this phone alone it is compliant, it does not mean that they did so because they wanted to be compliant, and all evidence points to a design reason and not to bow down to Google.
So what is my proof of this? Based on current and future designs of 2013, HTC has more phones being made with both an sd card slot and a task switching button. (Note: htc has not used a menu button on any of their phones since 2012. So by default, if anyone says that HTC removed the menu button on the One to comply is wrong by default, as they haven't had one for over a year)
Because HTC has never been in the past, and currently is not concerned with Google and is putting more phones right now in the Asian market with sd cards and a 3rd hardware button.

So my point about compliance has to be true if they are repeatedly going to be non compliant in general about their hardware that they offer.

So again, why do I personally think that the One doesn't have a menu button? It was due to design that HTC wanted, or to be different then other OEMs. In fact, HTC has done a lot of things differntly in their phones as compared to others BECAUSE they don't want their UI to be the same as everyone else's android phone. Some good examples are, drastically different UI for task switching, having a non standard home button that now makes users learn a new tap dance in order to bring up the task switcher, up and down vs left to right app draw scrolling, different way to add or remove apps as compared to other android phones...I can go on all day.

So my point is, "IF" like you say, that HTC is doing something because they want to be uniformly like other android phones, or to comply with a standard that will also have the same benefits, then I would have to respectfully disagree based on the fact that as of last year, HTC has been doing just the opposite so that they hope to stand out and be different then other android phones.

Now let's get back to "is it a developer's fault for the black box because they didn't update thier software?". And if so, just how many apps are effected, since we were repeatedly told it is just a few....

Well, it turns out that it is a lot of apps, not a few. Most navigation apps, some games, even Facebook and Taptalk are effected. I also want to point out that while they are effected, they are all fully functional on the HTC One without any further updates needed.

Now, let's just say that I'm a part time developer who happens to work on taptalk.
Taptalk needs a functional menu in order to work. It doesn't need a hardware menu button to work, it will already work without one now with the HTC One. So since it already is fully functional now, why the "need" for an update?
Oh, to get rid of the black bar? Well clearly you didn't think things through...

If you want me to help update taptalk further, to comply with Google's standards, then now I would have no choice but to put a software menu button or a black bar that contains a menu button on the screen FOR EVERY ANDROID DEVICE. Now hundreds of android devices are effected by the black bar instead of just 2 or 3. THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT ME TO DO? Effect thousands of users, who most won't like the effect, just to comply with Google? Dude, you can't pay me enough money to ruin an app that thousands use and love all because of some standard...that I'm not even forced in any way to comply. For uniformity sake is a good reason, but this isn't Apple, this is android...the best part of android is that you don't have to comply with any request from Google. You can do exactly like what HTC has been doing and change things up or do you're own thing.

So, my point is, because with android you can do different things then what is asked, now people who use apps like taptalk or navigation apps, don't have to have a black bar on the screen if they don't want one...they just have to buy a non nexus and now a non HTC One device.

Choice is good. No choice is bad.
Personally the black bar doesn't bother me, but it clearly bothers some. But yes, HTC could have avoided this if they wanted, as nobody was twisting their arm to have this issue. Again, this is not Apple, Google does not force any OEM to comply. So IMHO the reason why the HTC One doesn't have an sd card slot and also doesn't have a menu button is because of a design choice that they made. After all, they clearly could have them if they wanted, just like the other phones that they are putting out this year.


sent with my 2 year old HTC evo3d

You plainly haven't the foggiest idea what googles standards are. The reason that apps have the bar, point blank period, is because developers have not properly updated their apps since January of 2012. Google provides the apis to do it, developers are just too lazy to make the effort. Any other conjecture on your part, including the entirety of your long - winded and ill - conceived post above, is wrong-headed, incorrect, and flat out false.

Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Tapatalk 2

 

[jd56hawk]

My iPhone 5 is on eBay right now. I was impressed with the HTC One before I saw it in the store, and when I did see it this past Friday I was even more impressed. Very simply, it doesn't feel big in your hand. I actually bought the Galaxy Note 2 and really liked it, but the only problem was I simply couldn't pull it out of my shirt pocket fast enough due to its size...not a big problem, sure, but I decided to trade it in for an iPhone 5.
I even tried out the Lumia 920 but decided to trade return it.
I have nothing against Samsung or Nokia or Apple...I never had the "sports fan" fervor that some people seem to have for their favorite team, but I must say that the iPhone and Lumia 920 are like works of art, and the HTC One is this year's artistic masterpiece.
I'm sure Salvador Dali would buy one if he were still alive. I'm not sure what he'd do with it, but I bet he'd like it.

 

[go3go]

OMG, the black bar thing again! Hasn't this thing been done to death already?

Fact of the matter is that this issue will gradually become a non-issue. And then you will wonder why you ever spent hours debating about it with some guy over the internet!

Seriously. I have the phone and the black bar is far from a big deal.

 

[alus415]

I also went to an ATT store to check out the phone and I'm impressed by the build and look but one HUGE concern was the phone got hot , no one was using it, I picked it up and started web browsing and the screen and back got very warm. I'm very disappointed in this , the only phone I remember getting slighty warm was the S3 but nothing compared to this.

I ordered my unlocked version but now I hope it was just a defective floor model but if my unit also gets hot then I'll be returning it and getting the S4. The Iphone 5 never got hot and uses the same materials.

 

[go3go]

I also went to an ATT store to check out the phone and I'm impressed by the build and look but one HUGE concern was the phone got hot , no one was using it, I picked it up and started web browsing and the screen and back got very warm. I'm very disappointed in this , the only phone I remember getting slighty warm was the S3 but nothing compared to this.

I ordered my unlocked version but now I hope it was just a defective floor model but if my unit also gets hot then I'll be returning it and getting the S4. The Iphone 5 never got hot and uses the same materials.

I haven't had it get beyond what I would consider to be warm, even with heavy web browsing or playing games and what not.It doesn't get any hotter than my iphone 4 did under the same stresses.

 

[shadrap]

Mine gets slightly warm, no more so than my iPhone did.

 

[stalemate1]

I also went to an ATT store to check out the phone and I'm impressed by the build and look but one HUGE concern was the phone got hot , no one was using it, I picked it up and started web browsing and the screen and back got very warm. I'm very disappointed in this , the only phone I remember getting slighty warm was the S3 but nothing compared to this.

I ordered my unlocked version but now I hope it was just a defective floor model but if my unit also gets hot then I'll be returning it and getting the S4. The Iphone 5 never got hot and uses the same materials.

There is a big difference between being hot and overheating. The device will easily work at 50 degrees Celsius also take into consideration that it has twice as many processors as the iPhone 5 and all of them have a much much higher clock rate (Ghz) the heat you felt was merely the extera performance.

 

[Topgonzo]

You also have to realise that when a phone is plugged in charging it can be hotter than normal.