Why is there so much dislike for the Blackberry Priv?

[anon(5630457)]

As someone who owned the Priv for a few weeks, I have to say my hatred for the Priv is because it has sub-par specs for such an expensive phone. The front-facing camera is terrible. The rear camera is barely passable with no OIS. There is no fingerprint sensor. The PKB is okay, but it's not useful. I found it was easier typing on the screen than on the PKB.

For the price point of the Priv, one can get something better, like the Note 5, S6 edge+, or the new S7 edge.

 

[bitek]

The one entitled, "BlackBerry Priv review: Android fixes the OS, but the hardware can’t compete: $700 for a bad keyboard, poor camera, iffy build quality, and old software? No thanks"? http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/11/blackberry-priv-review-android-fixes-the-os-but-the-hardware-cant-compete/

Here's what I got out of the review:

Build Quality: Terrible ("You can hear plastic scrape against plastic when you open or close the device.")
Build Materials: Terrible ("It features a spongy back material that feels like a plastic frame with a rubber skin wrapped around it.")
Build Design: Terrible (poorly curved screen, pointless mute button, fake speaker grill, MicroUSB, slide out keyboard)
Keyboard: Terrible ("The slide-out keyboard feels like the Priv's entire reason for existing, but it just isn't any good. BlackBerry's hardware keys might have had a leg up on 3.5-inch devices, but today the keys are microscopic compared to the software keyboard on any 5-inch phone. The tiny keys make it easy to press the wrong button, and typing becomes a cramped, uncomfortable experience.")
Software: Outdated, branded and dirtied
Picture Unlock: Terrible (Too sensitive, slow and prone to errors)
Camera: Absolute Garbage ("It's especially bad for a $700 device. In our camera test it was absolutely wrecked by the $380 Nexus 5X")
Processor Performance: Decent. Pretty close to on par with the Nexus 5X
Battery Life: Decent (with screen on low brightness, not great)
Pricing: Terrible ("...pricing your Android phone at $700 is a boastful statement that you've made a kick-***, no compromise device. The BlackBerry Priv can't back up that kind of bragging, though, and that's why it's a failure. Other than the subpar keyboard and camera, everything on the Priv is merely passable. It's a "C" student, but the price demands we grade on a curve that flunks the Priv.")

Overall: Do Not Buy ("Maybe BlackBerry will convince some enterprise customers to buy a few Privs for their business, but for normal consumers, there is nothing compelling here. The Nexus 6P has better specs, a better camera, an aluminum body, and stock Android with updates direct from Google. It's also $200 less than the Priv. There is still no reason to buy a BlackBerry.")

---

Moving away from their review, the other things that are important? Screen Quality? It fails. Being able to buy and use it on your carrier? It fails.

All of that said, there are still several users with BB nostalgia or that sincerely appreciate the features that BB brings and even Russell for Android Central did a relatively positive review of it (he likes it a lot, but it feels like he likes the concepts more than the execution). This isn't the worst device ever made by any stretch of the imagination, but it is far from the best. And it is really hard for people to swallow the fact that there are at least 7 better devices (so far named in this thread) available for less money and with far fewer compromises. If BB wants a to do list of things to fix for 2016, this post may cover it. That or they can release the same mid-range phone at a low to midrange price and then we're having a slightly different conversation about the level of expectations.

http://www.androidcentral.com/blackberry-priv-review

Look i understand that you went out of your way to find negative review. I am sure that there are negative reviews about your 6p. The point is that majority of priv reviews ARE positive. Here are some for you to digest. Most people do disagree with you and the review you mentioned.

https://youtu.be/5Yiwvpc2d98 priv review

https://youtu.be/J0PjzmgWPso priv vs 6p

https://youtu.be/3hovuWZgTEg

https://youtu.be/I6kRfjhfG8c

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/11/07/blackberry-priv-review/#2208b539164c

http://www.androidauthority.com/blackberry-priv-review-656894/

http://www.trustedreviews.com/blackberry-priv-review

Posted via BlackBerry priv

 

[bitek]

As someone who owned the Priv for a few weeks, I have to say my hatred for the Priv is because it has sub-par specs for such an expensive phone. The front-facing camera is terrible. The rear camera is barely passable with no OIS. There is no fingerprint sensor. The PKB is okay, but it's not useful. I found it was easier typing on the screen than on the PKB.

For the price point of the Priv, one can get something better, like the Note 5, S6 edge+, or the new S7 edge.

I totally disagree with you except for front facing camera but I knew about it when I got the phone. I guess blackberry could not fit in small enough sensor unless you want it to have bulge like on 6p. As to physical keyboard it is way better experience than typing on the screen. I have choice of both and I choose physical keyboard 8/10 times. This after having all screen keyboard for 2 years+

Posted via BlackBerry priv

 

[bitek]

Re: why so much dislike for blackberry

You're going to make me want to go cite a source and I don't have time right now but I will go find it. What I was looking at was basically four points.

1. Encryption - Blackberry has a new proprietary way of dealing with encryption. I do not know if it is actually better or just a different way of doing it. I also don't know if Android encryption is regularly being "broken" to make this an issue of differentiation.

2. There's an app that gives the user feedback on their current security settings. This is AWESOME. But stupid users can still do things they don't understand and make their devices unsafe. And smart users don't need the feedback. But for everyday users who may accidentally do strange things, this is good.

3. Security updates within 30 days. Depending on the month, BlackBerry always has a significant chance of being less secure than Nexus devices but will normally be more secure than all other OEM devices - like the ones that people who don't read Android Central actually buy.

4. Marshmallow isn't on the PRIV yet. This takes some intrinsic security features out of the equation and takes away user control over app permissions, etc. This is the biggest area of opportunity for BB. Don't release devices on old software and then take months to update it while talking about security. Obviously you have some stuff to test, etc. That's cool. Get it done and on devices.

I do not what to say except of the fact that world leaders use blackberry phones only for security including US president so I guess if blackberry does not know how to do with security then I do not know who is.

Another prime example is sony which after being hacked damped own phones and activated back blackberry phones.

Yeah but you know better about security for sure

Posted via BlackBerry priv

 

[bitek]

You state that people care about security, yet they're not buying a phone you say is the most secure. That's the definition of not caring about security. BB would still be doing well if people cared.



No, we don't officially know the numbers... but from BBs statements the numbers aren't very impressive at all. Check out the Crackberry forum to see it.



On contract (which is how most people buy their phones) the S6 Edge 32gb is $300 compared to the Priv's 410. Both have curved screens.



And like I said, even if the Priv has better call quality - that doesn't mean other phones have poor call quality. I had the Nexus 5 and am currently using the 6P - and call quality is fantastic. Never had an issue. It's an area that doesn't need improvement. Once again - if call quality were an issue then people wouldn't be buying these phones.



That's nice. But no one seems to have an issue with the virtual keyboards on othe Android devices. There are so many choices available to them on the Play Store. No one is complaining.



It was available on BB10 - did anyone care? I'm not seeing a huge lineup for the Priv because of it either.
Mark my words, when BB realizes the Priv just isn't selling well enough - the Hub will be made available for other phones. Just like BBM was a BB-only staple - BB realized they had to port ielsewhere. I predict the Hub will be available to all android phones in 6-12 months.

Blackberry does not do well because apple brought good product and google used IBM tactics and blackberry was slow to turn around.

I do not think blackberry will ever go back to its glory but it can definitely be major player for Android phones. Blackberry needs few good phones to improve its tarnished name. Based on bb10 I know the company can improve its software significantly. Bb10 did not catch up because of lack of support from developers.
With blackberry entering android world this problem is gone.

Posted via BlackBerry priv

 

[D13H4RD2L1V3]

Honestly, I don't hate the PRIV. I kinda like it because it's different due to that keyboard and also because I enjoyed using it.

What I don't like is the price. It's frankly too expensive for what it has and you can do better for the same price or lower.

A Canadian friend of mine had to sell his PRIV because his unit ran pretty hot and also had pretty poor standby battery life. I'm not sure how many other units have the same issue, but I attribute it to a defect until something changes. He uses a graphite Nexus 6P now.

 

[Aquila]

Look i understand that you went out of your way to find negative review. I am sure that there are negative reviews about your 6p. The point is that majority of priv reviews ARE positive. Here are some for you to digest. Most people do disagree with you and the review you mentioned.


Posted via BlackBerry priv

I didn't do any searching on that. I linked the review mentioned from the person that I quoted in my post and it happened to line up almost exactly with the real review, the comments of actual users within the forums. Obviously there going to be people who like and dislike different things about it. I don't have any objections to people liking things I don't. I just don't like an attempt to tell people that this is the end-all of devices, when it's truly a mediocre attempt at best. The Android platform is a place for variety to thrive - I truly believe that. But that doesn't mean experiment and push out half-baked devices. In my opinion, this device truly sucks compared to the real flagships and that is unfortunate, because a superb execution on this thing would have led to an entirely different reception.

From your links:
"A solid first effort, but not without its flaws" (subtitle of review)
"Cons: Below-average performance, expensive, no fingerprint scanner"
"The BlackBerry Priv is a Hail Mary pass by the former tech powerhouse..."
"Overall build quality is just a little bit questionable"
"Snapdragon 808 bogged down by lack of software polish"
"Camera missing a lot of features and lacks in processing, aggressively decent"
Heck, battery life, camera, performance, software and design all rated at or below the inflated aggregate score that AA gave it (they obviously didn't use their normal scale). And they said, "The BlackBerry Priv is a great first attempt by the company to slide into Android, but it doesn't quite match up the competition where it truly counts".

But just so we're not picking and choosing (as I haven't done, I used the recommended one):

The first 5 reviews from a Google Search:

1. "Android and an awesome keyboard make the Priv the best BlackBerry in years, but if you're not a keyboard lover and aren't much of a security seeker, you'll find phones that are cheaper, or offer better features than the Priv. 7.6/10.0" cnet
2. "The underwhelming Android experience is another brow raiser. Some growing pains are all but expected and BlackBerry will surely work out the kicks eventually, but still, if you go into a store today and shell out the eye-watering amount of money for the Priv, you might naturally expect it to at least perform up to par with let's say a Galaxy S6 flagship, an iPhone 6s or any other hip device." gsmarena
3. "Battery Performance Is Sketchy At Best; There Are Some Performance Gremlins; Keyboard Isn't As Good As Passport's Setup 3.5/5.0" knowyourmobile
4. "Chock-Full of really good ideas, badly executed, 7.4/10.0" theverge
5. "Keyboard isn't great, high price, ships with Android Lollipop. 77/100" engadget

engadget has a nice feature where it shows you scores from 10 sites at once. Of the 10, Android Central gave it the best review with a 9.0/10.0. The average rating was 7.8/10.0.

An example of a much better device with a pricetag that is about 30% lower, every review gave it an 8 or above, most are 9 and there's a 10 in there. 8.7 average/10.0.

So the same people who generally liked the Priv (7.8 average isn't horrible, it is mediocre), also LOVED the Nexus 6P. That's one example. The Nexus 5X also did better, average 8. So did the Note 5, Moto X Pure Edition, LG G4, LG V10, Nexus 6, iPhone 6s, etc, etc. And every single one of them is cheaper than the Priv. And the Priv is the only one with an average rating below an 8. It's closest competitor is the Nexus 5X - which is literally half the price. And still a better device.

Same reviewers, across the board, like the Priv (or at least don't hate it) and like all the real flagships more.

The only conclusion that can be reached here: The best devices, almost universally acknowledged as being better, are all cheaper than the Priv.

So are we ready to move on from the "overpriced" argument or is there more we need to flesh out here?

 

[Aquila]

Re: why so much dislike for blackberry

I do not what to say except of the fact that world leaders use blackberry phones only for security including US president so I guess if blackberry does not know how to do with security then I do not know who is.

Another prime example is sony which after being hacked damped own phones and activated back blackberry phones.

Yeah but you know better about security for sure

Posted via BlackBerry priv

I didn't say it is unsecure; I said that there is a huge area of opportunity. Two big things that would help: Getting onto the latest OS version and getting security updates out in 24-48 hours. Your example is classically a red herring, because there are probably approximately 0 world leaders using an Android made by BlackBerry. They're probably all using actual BlackBerry devices running BlackBerry's OS. Also, world leaders use iPhones and Android devices as well. I've even seen a Windows phone.

I am not making a claim that I know more about security than BlackBerry does - I am saying I do not know how meaningful what they did is and pointing out some obvious chinks in the armor that are easy to resolve.

 

[Morty2264]

I agree with you that the pairing of Android and BlackBerry is absolutely phenomenal: BB has bridged the app gap here AND has given us a great (yes, other physical keyboards have been better and some gripe that the Priv keyboard is too narrow; but it's still a very smart, efficient keyboard, as its predecessors are/were) physical keyboard. That is the best of both worlds, in my opinion.

I frequent CrackBerry forums a lot, and have for years, and there is a lot of discussion over there with regards to the Priv: CrackBerry users either love it or they hate it - there doesn't seem to be a (vocal) middle ground. I theorize that some BB enthusiasts see the Priv as a "traitor device" of some sort (I've seen some users sort of state this); whereas other CB users, like me, think the new change is refreshing and awesome. Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, obviously; but this is just what I've seen and perceived around the forums. As someone who has loved and used BlackBerry devices for years, I have a lot of respect for the OS (yes, I know it's not perfect; but what OS is completely spotless in terms of never having issues, bugs, things to improve upon, etc.?), I can understand why maybe some traditionalist BB users may be averse to the Priv. But I still think it's a fabulous innovation that combines stellar BB hardware and efficient Android OS. And the security BB is known for.

Some people out there seem to follow the idea that BB is "worthless" and so even if BB and Android pair up and release a great device (the Priv), they will still see the company as a failure, no matter what. People go with trends, and BB is not necessarily a trend to a lot of people. I personally go for uniqueness as well, and so I love BlackBerry devices and the physical keyboards; but some go for "what's in" and so they overlook BlackBerry - and, quite possibly, the Priv - without giving it the benefit of the doubt first (and I don't just mean "the benefit of the doubt" as far as purchasing it; I also mean "the benefit of the doubt" by considering BB/the Priv as worthwhile, usable, reliable, etc.). Opinions and purchases are obviously subjective' and everyone's entitled to buy what they want with their hard-earned money; but biases and judgment will always exist, especially in an industry as competitive as the smartphone world.

As far as price goes: people will often buy into trends, too. If the Priv/BB isn't trending, they may want to buy what is; and may, *may* overlook the price tag. But these people may also harp on the Priv for a similar highly-labeled price tag, too. Again, bias and judgments. For example, I am similar: I see the Priv as expensive, yes; but I see the iPhones as hugely expensive. I've bought BB's but never iPhones, and I harp about the price of iPhones. Hypocritical and biases here, on my part? Yes, absolutely (and I'm being honest here). But if you like something, you defend it and overlook some of the bad points; just as you may feel like you may want to put something down a little harder because you don't like it. It's just biases, and being honest, and that's okay.

So, yeah. The Priv is underrated in a way, because people may still buy into the trend that BB is not "super cool." But it's a great device and I've heard good things. And I personally think it's a good-looking device for form and function.

 

[FirstBerry101]

Thank you for this post. I like my Priv more and more everyday.

To a couple points.

The software isn't anymore buggy than any other Phone on have used.

The keyboard is clearly the selling point. In can type faster on glass now too... but the experience is better a keyboard. For one liners I use glass, if I want to get a paragraph types out , keyboard flipped on.

Its all about preference.

People say it sucks but they never have tried it. Why write an opinion at all?

Posted via the Android Central App

 

[bitek]

I didn't do any searching on that. I linked the review mentioned from the person that I quoted in my post and it happened to line up almost exactly with the real review, the comments of actual users within the forums. Obviously there going to be people who like and dislike different things about it. I don't have any objections to people liking things I don't. I just don't like an attempt to tell people that this is the end-all of devices, when it's truly a mediocre attempt at best. The Android platform is a place for variety to thrive - I truly believe that. But that doesn't mean experiment and push out half-baked devices. In my opinion, this device truly sucks compared to the real flagships and that is unfortunate, because a superb execution on this thing would have led to an entirely different reception.

From your links:
"A solid first effort, but not without its flaws" (subtitle of review)
"Cons: Below-average performance, expensive, no fingerprint scanner"
"The BlackBerry Priv is a Hail Mary pass by the former tech powerhouse..."
"Overall build quality is just a little bit questionable"
"Snapdragon 808 bogged down by lack of software polish"
"Camera missing a lot of features and lacks in processing, aggressively decent"
Heck, battery life, camera, performance, software and design all rated at or below the inflated aggregate score that AA gave it (they obviously didn't use their normal scale). And they said, "The BlackBerry Priv is a great first attempt by the company to slide into Android, but it doesn't quite match up the competition where it truly counts".

But just so we're not picking and choosing (as I haven't done, I used the recommended one):

The first 5 reviews from a Google Search:

1. "Android and an awesome keyboard make the Priv the best BlackBerry in years, but if you're not a keyboard lover and aren't much of a security seeker, you'll find phones that are cheaper, or offer better features than the Priv. 7.6/10.0" cnet
2. "The underwhelming Android experience is another brow raiser. Some growing pains are all but expected and BlackBerry will surely work out the kicks eventually, but still, if you go into a store today and shell out the eye-watering amount of money for the Priv, you might naturally expect it to at least perform up to par with let's say a Galaxy S6 flagship, an iPhone 6s or any other hip device." gsmarena
3. "Battery Performance Is Sketchy At Best; There Are Some Performance Gremlins; Keyboard Isn't As Good As Passport's Setup 3.5/5.0" knowyourmobile
4. "Chock-Full of really good ideas, badly executed, 7.4/10.0" theverge
5. "Keyboard isn't great, high price, ships with Android Lollipop. 77/100" engadget

engadget has a nice feature where it shows you scores from 10 sites at once. Of the 10, Android Central gave it the best review with a 9.0/10.0. The average rating was 7.8/10.0.

An example of a much better device with a pricetag that is about 30% lower, every review gave it an 8 or above, most are 9 and there's a 10 in there. 8.7 average/10.0.

So the same people who generally liked the Priv (7.8 average isn't horrible, it is mediocre), also LOVED the Nexus 6P. That's one example. The Nexus 5X also did better, average 8. So did the Note 5, Moto X Pure Edition, LG G4, LG V10, Nexus 6, iPhone 6s, etc, etc. And every single one of them is cheaper than the Priv. And the Priv is the only one with an average rating below an 8. It's closest competitor is the Nexus 5X - which is literally half the price. And still a better device.

Same reviewers, across the board, like the Priv (or at least don't hate it) and like all the real flagships more.

The only conclusion that can be reached here: The best devices, almost universally acknowledged as being better, are all cheaper than the Priv.

So are we ready to move on from the "overpriced" argument or is there more we need to flesh out here?

I never said priv is perfect. It is first android phone from blackberry. Sure there will be issues. The review you picked was entirely negative written by somebody who has hard on on blackberry. I mean tech site like the verge had a lot good stuff to say about priv any this is iPhone fun site. Pretty much all reviews are positive to some degree Software issues will get fixed .Blackberry hardware is goo. Blackberry has much more experience in fixing software problem that than most oems.

The point is you make your judgement without even trying the phone. I do not believe you ever had it in your hands. And that is why I stared the discussion. People like you judge priv based on the name not actually based on actual experience. I am saying try it out become blackberry brings exciting stuff to the table. Android needs it. Priv is solid first android phone. Software will get better in short time. Priv willing get marshmallow with best blackberry security. Blackberry release software that is secure so it takes more time to test.

You should really read this

http://www.cnet.com/news/how-i-learned-to-stop-worrying-and-love-the-blackberry-priv/

Posted via BlackBerry priv

 

[Aquila]

People say it sucks but they never have tried it. Why write an opinion at all?

The OP came in and asked for opinions on some of the objections to the Priv. Seems like they're asking for opinions?

 

[Aquila]

I never said priv is perfect. It is first android phone from blackberry. Sure there will be issues. The review you picked was entirely negative written by somebody who has hard on on blackberry. I mean tech site like the verge had a lot good stuff to say about priv any this is iPhone fun site. Pretty much all reviews are positive to some degree Software issues will get fixed .Blackberry hardware is goo. Blackberry has much more experience in fixing software problem that than most oems.

The point is you make your judgement without even trying the phone. I do not believe you ever had it in your hands. And that is why I stared the discussion. People like you judge priv based on the name not actually based on actual experience. I am saying try it out become blackberry brings exciting stuff to the table. Android needs it. Priv is solid first android phone. Software will get better in short time. Priv willing get marshmallow with best blackberry security. Blackberry release software that is secure so it takes more time to test.

You should really read this

How I learned to stop worrying and love the BlackBerry Priv - CNET

Posted via BlackBerry priv

Where in any of my arguments do you see me either bashing the name or saying I haven't played with the device? I was very clear that I WANTED to like it and was disappointed. I feel like there is a disconnect here because I have been comparing this device on its merits versus similar qualities in its competition. I cannot judge a device on how it will be in the future, because neither of us know what will really happen. What I can say is that right now, the Priv is interesting yet uncompelling - especially at a very high price. I have no animosity whatsoever towards BlackBerry or people that like BlackBerry devices. What I have is very high expectations for execution on flagship Android Devices. I'm the moderator team leader on an Android forum. I live and breathe this stuff. I know what I like and am very intentional about my criteria, ethics and methodology. The Priv doesn't pass muster right now. I hope the 2016 version does.

 

[bitek]

Thank you for this post. I like my Priv more and more everyday.

To a couple points.

The software isn't anymore buggy than any other Phone on have used.

The keyboard is clearly the selling point. In can type faster on glass now too... but the experience is better a keyboard. For one liners I use glass, if I want to get a paragraph types out , keyboard flipped on.

Its all about preference.

People say it sucks but they never have tried it. Why write an opinion at all?

Posted via the Android Central App

My point exactly

Posted via BlackBerry priv

 

[Almeuit]

I believe we are done here. It is all good to have a post to discuss various opinions and such but this post has turned into more about telling others how they are wrong for their opinions and how they shouldn't post. This doesn't make sense for a civil discussion where the original post asked for people's opinions.

Thanks all.

 

[Russell Holly]

Re: why so much dislike for blackberry

You're going to make me want to go cite a source and I don't have time right now but I will go find it. What I was looking at was basically four points.

— Sweet, a detailed answer! I had a feeling you'd have some thoughts on this, and I'm glad you decided to answer.

1. Encryption - Blackberry has a new proprietary way of dealing with encryption. I do not know if it is actually better or just a different way of doing it. I also don't know if Android encryption is regularly being "broken" to make this an issue of differentiation.

— I see your point here. Personally I don't care if it's better or not, I'm not a fan of proprietary security over open security. BlackBerry can't demonstrate that their method is "better" without exposing how it works.

2. There's an app that gives the user feedback on their current security settings. This is AWESOME. But stupid users can still do things they don't understand and make their devices unsafe. And smart users don't need the feedback. But for everyday users who may accidentally do strange things, this is good.

— I think you'd be surprised here. For example, it's still fairly common to find "knowledgeable" users who think pattern lock is a secure authentication method, even though it has been beaten in seconds by several research teams.

3. Security updates within 30 days. Depending on the month, BlackBerry always has a significant chance of being less secure than Nexus devices but will normally be more secure than all other OEM devices - like the ones that people who don't read Android Central actually buy.

— While we're only four months in, BlackBerry has had Google's monthly security patch available to download before Nexus phones have had it every single month. In the last two months, my Priv has had that patch two full weeks before my 6P. It's the same stuff, but I think right now this claim doesn't quite hold up.

4. Marshmallow isn't on the PRIV yet. This takes some intrinsic security features out of the equation and takes away user control over app permissions, etc. This is the biggest area of opportunity for BB. Don't release devices on old software and then take months to update it while talking about security. Obviously you have some stuff to test, etc. That's cool. Get it done and on devices.

#4 — I both agree and disagree on this one. On the one hand, the way Marshmallow handles USB input is, in fact, more secure and should be on the Priv ASAP. On the other hand, BlackBerry is keeping up with monthly patches and applying some of their own in the process. The latest version of the software should absolutely be available as early as possible, but if I had to choose between BlackBerry frontloading all of the security patches and delaying Marshmallow over Motorola's rush to get out Marshmallow and then not push a single security update, I would certainly go with the former if digital security was my goal.