I wanna know your opinions about the notch.

[Mike Dee]

I am sorry. The things that you stated are false claims are not false. Pixel 3XL has a lower screen to body ratio than other phones listed in my post. I never said and compared to Pixel 2XL screen to body ratio as that phone doesn’t have a notch. So not sure why you accuse me of false claims.

You consider dual cameras as new tech, may be to Google, not for the tech industry as a whole. That is a fact as well. Every manufacturer differentiates by features offered and Google decided to go this route. That is a fact. My opinion is that led to a lower screen to body ratio (which is also true when you compare them) for 3XL.

It’s a public forum and I do make sure as a trusted member of MONA and community review team do not spread false claims.

So how do we add new components that didn't exist before into existing space regardless of how old they are while trying to increase screen real estate? By the way dual selfie cameras are not that old that I consider it old tech and that's without investigating how Google leverages that technology for creating better photos.

 

[Itsa_Me_Mario]

Seriously? Complete your thoughts with my full sentence, not half of it:

I will applaud manufacturers who use the notch to accommodate new components as well increase screen to body ratio.

I am done with this thread as it seems like a thread to praise the notch. If you want to dispute my facts, bring the entire quote, not parts of it. It doesnt make sense. Enjoy your 3 XL.

I quoted the entire post. All of it, every word.

Given that Google did both of the things which you applaud, did you applaud them? No, you pretended that they did not do either of the things which you applaud. That's the part that is false, or incorrect, or whatever label you want for it.

 

[digitalbreak]

I quoted the entire post. All of it, every word.

Given that Google did both of the things which you applaud, did you applaud them? No, you pretended that they did not do either of the things which you applaud. That's the part that is false, or incorrect, or whatever label you want for it.

Please read my entire posts before you accuse of me false claims. Since you are not doing that , here is a screen to body ratio of 3XL compared to some other phones in the market:

- Pixel 3XL screen to body ratio with the notch: 82.8%
- OnePlus 6 with the notch: 83.81%
- S9+ without the notch: 83.9%
- Xs Max with the notch: 84.4%

Here is a site listing the s:b for other phones with notch: https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/bezel-less-phone-comparison/

I am done as I didn’t wanted your post to linger around saying I did not stat facts.

 

[Mike Dee]

I feel they coul have done a better job. The features the notch brings are worth it but they should have found a way to make it look less clumsy.

That would be feasible if they made the body larger. In order to make it fit in the same virtual body and bezel size as the 2XL there doesn't appear to be much wiggle room.

 

[mustang7757]

This, plus lose the great software, lose the great camera, Pixel stand functionality, etc.



First paragraph makes 5 statements. 4 are clearly false, the other was an opinion which was the only statement in the post which addressed the question.

I get this thing is polarizing, but I do not understand why. I also don't understand why some people have all these conspiracy theories about it and/or why they like making up things about it.



The iPhone notch is bigger, approximately 46% more area. They do not currently offer the functionality that the Pixel cameras do, and vice versa. They have different purposes.

Notches and chins are not related to each other. They house different hardware, exist for different reasons and have different functionality.

7 statements, 6 are false.

This is false. Premise is correct, the pixel notch is 9% deeper, but the iPhone one is so much wider that it results in the iPhone notch taking up 46% more area.



First two statements are false, third is irrelevant, last one is misguided because the appealed to source is wrong about the same things.



Do you have another example of a device with the Pixels dual camera equipment and functionality with the same speaker setup that has a notch, yet does it "better"? I keep seeing comparisons to phones that done have dual front facing speakers and don't have the two cameras and all associated functionality.

But Google did do both parts of what you're asking for, you just don't like the implementation. They did increase s:b, because it's higher than the Pixel 2 XL, with the same dimensions. They did add in new technology, because there's another camera up there with a boatload of software features that the hardware improvement enabled.

Of course not, that person is referencing a phone that does not exist (Pixel 4 Ultra). They're also comparing the Pixels to the OnePlus line, which is possibly even more erroneous.

You get great software experience on the 1+ 6 that's not one thing it's lacking

 

[Mike Dee]

You get great software experience on the 1+ 6 that's not one thing it's lacking

 

[mustang7757]

Take that

 

[Itsa_Me_Mario]

Please read my entire posts before you accuse of me false claims. Since you are not doing that , here is a screen to body ratio of 3XL compared to some other phones in the market:

- Pixel 3XL screen to body ratio with the notch: 82.8%
- OnePlus 6 with the notch: 83.81%
- S9+ without the notch: 83.9%
- Xs Max with the notch: 84.4%

Here is a site listing the s:b for other phones with notch: https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/bezel-less-phone-comparison/

I am done as I didn’t wanted your post to linger around saying I did not stat facts.

Your first sentence is the most important in this post. I am reading all of the posts in this thread, and trying to deal with each one fairly according to its own merits. 1) I am not accusing you of anything; if I was, I would rephrase it that you are lying. 2) What I am stating is that the information which you posted is incorrect.

1) The former would be an unjustified ad hominem, which I'm not going to do because I have no idea whether or not you are intentionally stating wrong information and for me to pretend I do know would be dishonest. I am not making any comments about your honesty or integrity or anything of the sort. If I had to guess, I would probably suggest that you may not have known that you were making conflicting statements or stating information which was based on assumption, rather than evidence.
2) The latter is an argument against the claims being made, which are statements that can be objectively verified as being true or false. Challenging the factual basis of a claim does NOT imply anything about the person who made the claim.

These two things combine to mean that I am not making any statements about you or accusing you of anything. What I am doing is attempting to correct some incorrect information in a forum. From your responses I think that I've done a poor job of getting that across, because it seems to me like you're taking my statements as attacks against you and I in no way intend my statements to be anything of the kind.

 

[Itsa_Me_Mario]

here is a screen to body ratio of 3XL compared to some other phones in the market:

- Pixel 3XL screen to body ratio with the notch: 82.8%
- OnePlus 6 with the notch: 83.81%
- S9+ without the notch: 83.9%
- Xs Max with the notch: 84.4%

Here is a site listing the s:b for other phones with notch: https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile...ne-comparison/

Addressing the argument itself:

Here's the whole quote again, "I will applaud manufacturers who use the notch to accommodate new components as well increase screen to body ratio".

The statement seems to say, and please correct me if I misinterpret what you mean by this sentence, that if an OEM uses a notch to a) add new components or features and b) reduce the screen to body ratio, then you approve or "applaud" that decision. If I'm misunderstanding your criteria or something else about your argument, then I can't address it properly. Assuming that this is close to correct, the following proceeds:

Example: The iPhone 8+ did not have the Face ID technology and had a low screen to body ratio of 67.7%. The iPhone X added a notch with a) added Face ID and b) increased the screen to body ratio up to 82.9%. Therefore criteria a and b are met, you approve and applaud them.

Example 2: The Pixel 2 XL did not have dual cameras and had a low screen to body ratio of 76.4%. The Pixel 3 XL added a notch with a) a second camera with added functionality and b) increased the screen to body ratio up to 82.8%. Therefore criteria a and b are met, you ... don't approve and applaud them? Why not?

Example 3: The OnePlus 5T did not have any technology other than a normal camera in the bezel and had a respectable 80.5% screen to body ratio. The OnePlus 6 added a notch with a) .... nothing and b) increased the screen to body ratio up to 83.8%. Therefore criteria a is NOT met and criteria b is met and therefore you ... approve and applaud them? Wait, what?

This logic is inconsistent, which translates to the conclusions being stated being incorrect. You applaud Apple, rightly so, for meeting your criteria. Yet you also applaud the OnePlus 6, which does NOT... and you FAIL to applaud Google which does, while falsely stating that Google does not meet your criteria, which was already addressed. You're also completely fine with the iPhone notch being bigger than the Pixel 3 XL notch.

You then threw in some other screen to bezel ratios of some other devices. But, as I challenged earlier, you have not given an apples to apples comparison. All of the devices that you listed lack dual front facing speakers, a feature that contributes to the "chin", which reduces the single number that you're providing in S:B and all also lack the second camera on the front. Can you provide a list of the devices with better S:B that have both dual front cameras and dual front facing speakers?

It actually seems to me like your case would best be suited to argue against the "chin", rather than the notch - as the one thing that the devices which you are listing as having better S:B do so primarily because of the smaller lower bezels, and in the case of Samsung, combining it with non existent side bezels.

But on the topic of notches, all it takes to change your statements from false claims to completely valid opinions is to clarify that 1) Google does meet your criteria for justifying a notch and 2) Google does so in a way that uses a smaller notch than Apple and 3) the features that Google uses to meet your criteria are not sufficient to make it worth it to your satisfaction. It's your criteria, that's easy to do. Change it to an opinion and this is all a moot point, because, as, I stated earlier, I have no problem with the assumption that whatever you state as being your opinion is in fact what you think.

 

[mustang7757]

Addressing the argument itself:

Here's the whole quote again, "I will applaud manufacturers who use the notch to accommodate new components as well increase screen to body ratio".

The statement seems to say, and please correct me if I misinterpret what you mean by this sentence, that if an OEM uses a notch to a) add new components or features and b) reduce the screen to body ratio, then you approve or "applaud" that decision. If I'm misunderstanding your criteria or something else about your argument, then I can't address it properly. Assuming that this is close to correct, the following proceeds:

Example: The iPhone 8+ did not have the Face ID technology and had a low screen to body ratio of 67.7%. The iPhone X added a notch with a) added Face ID and b) increased the screen to body ratio up to 82.9%. Therefore criteria a and b are met, you approve and applaud them.

Example 2: The Pixel 2 XL did not have dual cameras and had a low screen to body ratio of 76.4%. The Pixel 3 XL added a notch with a) a second camera with added functionality and b) increased the screen to body ratio up to 82.8%. Therefore criteria a and b are met, you ... don't approve and applaud them? Why not?

Example 3: The OnePlus 5T did not have any technology other than a normal camera in the bezel and had a respectable 80.5% screen to body ratio. The OnePlus 6 added a notch with a) .... nothing and b) increased the screen to body ratio up to 83.8%. Therefore criteria a is NOT met and criteria b is met and therefore you ... approve and applaud them? Wait, what?

This logic is inconsistent, which translates to the conclusions being stated being incorrect. You applaud Apple, rightly so, for meeting your criteria. Yet you also applaud the OnePlus 6, which does NOT... and you FAIL to applaud Google which does, while falsely stating that Google does not meet your criteria, which was already addressed. You're also completely fine with the iPhone notch being bigger than the Pixel 3 XL notch.

You then threw in some other screen to bezel ratios of some other devices. But, as I challenged earlier, you have not given an apples to apples comparison. All of the devices that you listed lack dual front facing speakers, a feature that contributes to the "chin", which reduces the single number that you're providing in S:B and all also lack the second camera on the front. Can you provide a list of the devices with better S:B that have both dual front cameras and dual front facing speakers?

It actually seems to me like your case would best be suited to argue against the "chin", rather than the notch - as the one thing that the devices which you are listing as having better S:B do so primarily because of the smaller lower bezels, and in the case of Samsung, combining it with non existent side bezels.

But on the topic of notches, all it takes to change your statements from false claims to completely valid opinions is to clarify that 1) Google does meet your criteria for justifying a notch and 2) Google does so in a way that uses a smaller notch than Apple and 3) the features that Google uses to meet your criteria are not sufficient to make it worth it to your satisfaction. It's your criteria, that's easy to do. Change it to an opinion and this is all a moot point, because, as, I stated earlier, I have no problem with the assumption that whatever you state as being your opinion is in fact what you think.

1 correction the s8+ has the Iris scanner

 

[Itsa_Me_Mario]

1 correction the s8+ has the Iris scanner

S9+? In what context are we talking? Phones with notches, two cameras and dual front facing speakers?

 

[mustang7757]

S9+? In what context are we talking? Phones with notches, two cameras and dual front facing speakers?

Paragraph 3 you said 8+ did not have face I'd which it did . The Iris scanner

 

[Itsa_Me_Mario]

Paragraph 3 you said 8+ did not have face I'd which it did . The Iris scanner

Example 1? I thought I was talking about the iPhone 8+

 

[mustang7757]

Paragraph 3 you said 8+ did not have face I'd which it did . The Iris scanner

I apologize Mario you said iPhone 8

 

[Itsa_Me_Mario]

I apologize Mario you said iPhone 8

No worries I said a lot of things today, not sure if any of them made sense. Today has been a Monday for sure.

 

[mustang7757]

No worries I said a lot of things today, not sure if any of them made sense. Today has been a Monday for sure.

You make sense most of the time , always like hearing your input on things .

 

[digitalbreak]

@Itsa_Me_Mario Thanks for the detailed post on explaining further on my posts. Let me try to articulate it more. And thanks for the DM

When you are adding design decisions such as the notch, the main criteria, as far as I have seen manufacturers put forth is increased screen to body ratio. That is absolutely true. There are some technical and design challenges every manufacturer goes through when incorporating such designs. Instead of a horizontal notch, Google decided to go for a tall one instead. If you had noticed, "tall" makes it look ugly and compromises more screen space than going "horizontal". Verge talks about this in their review.

https://youtu.be/rSFNpJJeo4c

You also bring up a valid point that our discussion may be that 3 XL has a bigger chin. Yes, another design element that goes along with such notch design in the bottom bezel. Essential Phone, even with a tiny notch and larger screen to body ration has a larger chin. The smaller notch allows them to have more screen to body ratio. iPhone Xs and other manufacturers have smaller bezels. Even Samsung phones now have smaller bezels, both at the top and the bottom.

Google relies on software experience. They don't rely on hardware a lot and you can see that when you compare the 2 and 3. The dual cameras are the only addional component on the front. I dont work for Google hardware team, but they could have opted for a more horizontal notch than a tall notch. Google isnt going to jump on the latest and greates tech as you don't see facial recognition or better surround sound experience or dual/triple rear camera setups - they will probably wait longer to incorporate those. So, technically, while the Huaweis/Samsungs push for more hardware innovation, Google, just like Apple, will slowdown and see how and where they want to invest. In that regards, they could have chosen Samsung's route of sporting smaller bezels. I am sure, even this community, woudl have welcomed that approach. I mean, in any case, no one asked for a notch, be it Pixel or iPhone or Huawei

Talking about the software experience, Google did not build a good software experience around the notch. Again, Verge talks about this in their review as well.

https://youtu.be/rSFNpJJeo4c


That is why I keep saying Google did not do a good job with the notch. They will probably fix this in a later update as its just software, so I am not hugely worried. Ideally, since its Google, I might have expected them to have fixed this showing other manufacturers how to do it. But IMHO, Essential has done this very well. If folks had isuses/questions on how the notification bar will work with Essential, well, you will be disappointed with Google's implementation right now with their notch.

So, from where I am looking at, as a technical gadget guy who reviews/uses gadgets, I feel Google could have done a better job in designing the notch and providing valid reasons for the same.

Hope this clarifies what I was trying to say and why I feel the notch in 3 XL could have been better.

Will Pixel 3XL be a great phone? Yes, absolutely.
Will I buy it? May be.
Should the notch be the reason you don't buy one? NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT!

 

[Itsa_Me_Mario]

I agree 100% that it could be better and look better.

 

[Mike Dee]

@Itsa_Me_Mario Thanks for the detailed post on explaining further on my posts. Let me try to articulate it more. And thanks for the DM

When you are adding design decisions such as the notch, the main criteria, as far as I have seen manufacturers put forth is increased screen to body ratio. That is absolutely true. There are some technical and design challenges every manufacturer goes through when incorporating such designs. Instead of a horizontal notch, Google decided to go for a tall one instead. If you had noticed, "tall" makes it look ugly and compromises more screen space than going "horizontal". Verge talks about this in their review.

https://youtu.be/rSFNpJJeo4c

You also bring up a valid point that our discussion may be that 3 XL has a bigger chin. Yes, another design element that goes along with such notch design in the bottom bezel. Essential Phone, even with a tiny notch and larger screen to body ration has a larger chin. The smaller notch allows them to have more screen to body ratio. iPhone Xs and other manufacturers have smaller bezels. Even Samsung phones now have smaller bezels, both at the top and the bottom.

Google relies on software experience. They don't rely on hardware a lot and you can see that when you compare the 2 and 3. The dual cameras are the only addional component on the front. I dont work for Google hardware team, but they could have opted for a more horizontal notch than a tall notch. Google isnt going to jump on the latest and greates tech as you don't see facial recognition or better surround sound experience or dual/triple rear camera setups - they will probably wait longer to incorporate those. So, technically, while the Huaweis/Samsungs push for more hardware innovation, Google, just like Apple, will slowdown and see how and where they want to invest. In that regards, they could have chosen Samsung's route of sporting smaller bezels. I am sure, even this community, woudl have welcomed that approach. I mean, in any case, no one asked for a notch, be it Pixel or iPhone or Huawei

Talking about the software experience, Google did not build a good software experience around the notch. Again, Verge talks about this in their review as well.

https://youtu.be/rSFNpJJeo4c


That is why I keep saying Google did not do a good job with the notch. They will probably fix this in a later update as its just software, so I am not hugely worried. Ideally, since its Google, I might have expected them to have fixed this showing other manufacturers how to do it. But IMHO, Essential has done this very well. If folks had isuses/questions on how the notification bar will work with Essential, well, you will be disappointed with Google's implementation right now with their notch.

So, from where I am looking at, as a technical gadget guy who reviews/uses gadgets, I feel Google could have done a better job in designing the notch and providing valid reasons for the same.

Hope this clarifies what I was trying to say and why I feel the notch in 3 XL could have been better.

Will Pixel 3XL be a great phone? Yes, absolutely.
Will I buy it? May be.
Should the notch be the reason you don't buy one? NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT!

I'm going take a leap of faith and speculate that Google has heard the "noise" and the HTC team will make some pleasant changes to the P4 series. In the meantime I'm going to enjoy my P3XL

 

[B. Diddy]

Re: How to disable the notch in Google Pixel 3 XL?

Welcome to Android Central! https://www.techadvisor.co.uk/how-to/mobile-phone/how-hide-notch-on-pixel-3-xl-3685254/