Is the S20 Ultra a failure?

[trucksmoveamerica#AC]

People who bought the phone: full defense and justification mode

Most other people: the phone is way too expensive and the camera in no way meets expectations

Not anymore expensive then the last 2 flagships Samsung released. Stop comparing these to the regular note 10 or S10 prices and their prices today. These are 5G devices, compare them to the 5G versions of the last 2 flagships. There is a reason to complain here, Samsung or Qualcomm forced us into 5G when it's not ready yet, they should have offered both yet.

I don't need justification to buy it, I bought it because I wanted to. Sounds to me like more need justification not to buy it because they can't afford it.

 

[Peter Scooze]

People who bought the phone: full defense and justification mode

Most other people: the phone is way too expensive and the camera in no way meets expectations

Defense mode? Do You know you can return the phone for full refund if u dont like it? And every phone is expensive. I could say the pixel 4 was extremely expensive for what you get. This is America nobody is forced to buy anything they dont want.

 

[Emig5m]

People who bought the phone: full defense and justification mode

Most other people: the phone is way too expensive and the camera in no way meets expectations

Um, no. I bought it and I'm criticizing it heavily! (but fairly and unbiasedly, telling it like it is, I tell both the good and the bad and call it exactly how I see it)

Oh and by the way (not necessarily speaking to the person I'm quoting, just making a general statement), when you break down all the devices that you would of bought in the past separately (still-cam, camcorder, GPS, portable music player, portable gaming device, phone, etc.etc.etc...) and add all that up, all of a sudden the prices of flagship smartphones seems very reasonable for what you're getting. I definitely don't miss the days of having to pay for map updates on my TomTom and they where very basic and didn't even have satellite imaging. I don't miss lugging around a separate still-cam and camcorder, compact disk player or even MP3 player (Zune, iPod, had them both). The price is very reasonable when you break it down like that. Price isn't very appealing if you already have a fairly recent flagship device like a S10 or Note 10 because you're paying bucko bucks for fairly minimal upgrades but the device is still very worth the price with my above example of breaking it down into multiple separate devices that you would of otherwise purchased separately in the past.

There is a problem though when the touted camera in the most expensive model has problems that didn't exist in prior gen phones or midrange/budget phone. That's a definite legit reason to complain no matter which way you look at it.

For those who just buy for phone useage and don't care about having top notch specs and cameras and everything I don't think they should be looking at flagships to begin with.

 

[Mike Dee]

A lot of people need extreme close ups (maybe a jeweler taking a closeup pic for a online sale) and I like to take macro shots of strange bugs and critters while I'm out and about. Maybe it's time to add a dedicated macro lens if new high megapixel and larger lenses that also don't have dual pixel auto focus can't properly handle point and shoot close up shots like in past phone cameras? Close up shots can be equally important as long range zooming.

That said, after trial and error I was finally able to learn to take slightly better macroshots with the S20U over the S10 after a painful learning curve. The same methods I've used to take pics from the S5 to the S10 doesn't apply to the S20U and I felt like I was relearning from scratch but I was finally able to learn and take good macroshots from the S20U without much fuss after getting a new routine down to science and comparing to the same macroshots with the S10, not only as good, but slightly better and more detailed. Not to mention I had the S10 for a year to get the camera down to science so it was good to able to get better macroshots with the S20U so quickly when initially they where horrible.

I meant testing for hunting in video mode going back and from distance to extreme close ups by moving finger back and forth in front of lens.

 

[trucksmoveamerica#AC]

Um, no. I bought it and I'm criticizing it heavily! (but fairly and unbiasedly, telling it like it is, I tell both the good and the bad and call it exactly how I see it)

Oh and by the way (not necessarily speaking to the person I'm quoting, just making a general statement), when you break down all the devices that you would of bought in the past separately (still-cam, camcorder, GPS, portable music player, portable gaming device, phone, etc.etc.etc...) and add all that up, all of a sudden the prices of flagship smartphones seems very reasonable for what you're getting. I definitely don't miss the days of having to pay for map updates on my TomTom and they where very basic and didn't even have satellite imaging. I don't miss lugging around a separate still-cam and camcorder, compact disk player or even MP3 player (Zune, iPod, had them both). The price is very reasonable when you break it down like that. Price isn't very appealing if you already have a fairly recent flagship device like a S10 or Note 10 because you're paying bucko bucks for fairly minimal upgrades but the device is still very worth the price with my above example of breaking it down into multiple separate devices that you would of otherwise purchased separately in the past.

There is a problem though when the touted camera in the most expensive model has problems that didn't exist in prior gen phones or midrange/budget phone. That's a definite legit reason to complain no matter which way you look at it.

For those who just buy for phone useage and don't care about having top notch specs and cameras and everything I don't think they should be looking at flagships to begin with.

I agree with most you say, but not everyone is buying it for the camera and for most the camera is good for them.

 

[Mike Dee]

People who bought the phone: full defense and justification mode

Most other people: the phone is way too expensive and the camera in no way meets expectations

Something is missing from Most other people.

 

[Emig5m]

I agree with most you say, but not everyone is buying it for the camera and for most the camera is good for them.

What if the display was only performing as good as a S3 and worse than most phones and had some added glitches that didn't exist before in prior gen phones like locking up and not registering touches under certain conditions? Would it be fair to let it off the hook and say that not everyone buys a phone for the display or should we all be in the same fight and hold the (flagship) device to the highest standards in every aspect? Especially in areas where it went backwards and degraded performance and usability.

 

[ThrottleJohnny]

What if the display was only performing as good as a S3 and worse than most phones and had some added glitches that didn't exist before in prior gen phones like locking up and not registering touches under certain conditions? Would it be fair to let it off the hook and say that not everyone buys a phone for the display or should we all be in the same fight and hold the (flagship) device to the highest standards in every aspect? Especially in areas where it went backwards and degraded performance and usability.

Apples and oranges. Not everyone agrees that the camera is worse. So who's right in this case? The people who say the camera is worse, or the people who think the camera is great?

If you can't get a consensus on that, you can't make broad stroke statements as if they're fact. You can only speak for yourself.

 

[rdrive41071]

What if the display was only performing as good as a S3 and worse than most phones and had some added glitches that didn't exist before in prior gen phones like locking up and not registering touches under certain conditions? Would it be fair to let it off the hook and say that not everyone buys a phone for the display or should we all be in the same fight and hold the (flagship) device to the highest standards in every aspect? Especially in areas where it went backwards and degraded performance and usability.

I really don't understand why you keep trying to convince people who like the camera, that they should not like the camera? The camera update further improves the camera also. Just look at the closeup shots in the update thread. You are acting like the camera is the equivalent of the galaxy s7.

 

[Emig5m]

Uh there's 100% proof that there's a focus problem. It's not opinion based. Plenty of videos on YouTube demonstrating the problem.

 

[Emig5m]

I really don't understand why you keep trying to convince people who like the camera, that they should not like the camera? The camera update further improves the camera also. Just look at the closeup shots in the update thread. You are acting like the camera is the equivalent of the galaxy s7.

Uh... just for your info if you haven't noticed, the person who posted those closeup shots in the update thread is me and that's without the update. Search on YouTube S20 Ultra focus hunting and slow focus and get up to date on your info and what the problem is. (Someone on here already mentioned that the update didn't make a difference or change anything for them, I have yet to get any camera update to try myself so until I try it myself I remain skeptical anything has been fixed) Thanks for the compliment on my closeup pics though.

 

[ThrottleJohnny]

Uh there's 100% proof that there's a focus problem. It's not opinion based. Plenty of videos on YouTube demonstrating the problem.

Again, that's an issue that needs fixing. That still doesn't prove that people hate the entire camera system. You act like no other phone camera has ever had issues out of the gate. Look no further than the Pixel 3/3xl.

 

[Emig5m]

This could be or could of been a hardware based problem unfixable with software updates though. (I'm sure you know why - phase detection vs dual pixel focus)

 

[ThrottleJohnny]

This could be or could of been a hardware based problem unfixable with software updates though. (I'm sure you know why - phase detection vs dual pixel focus)

It might be, it might not be. What is it you want people to do? Some people like their cameras, the people that don't are returning the phone. What more do you want?

 

[Emig5m]

It might be, it might not be. What is it you want people to do? Some people like their cameras, the people that don't are returning the phone. What more do you want?

I want a hug. I feel like I'm lacking moral support today hehe.

 

[ThrottleJohnny]

I want a hug. I feel like I'm lacking moral support today hehe.

LOL...

I get the feeling that this is just not the phone for you. Maybe accept that and try something else. Nothing wrong with that. But all this round and round over a smartphone camera is just wasting time imo. The camera is what it is.

It will be marginally better with updates, but will still be a slightly improved Samsung camera. Some people will love it, others will be more meh.

That's really all there is to it.

 

[Emig5m]

Well in my defense I have also been defending the camera at the same time. It was me who figured out the closeup/macro shots with it and was helping frustrated people take those types of shots when they where getting poor results (even on the Samsung forum) I've said nothing but praise over the zoom quality of the ultra - it's the best in the biz for smartphones currently. I did some comparison pics side by side showing the pic quality was better than the S10. I wouldn't have kept it after comparing it in depth with my S10 if I didn't think that it didn't have a better camera overall. There's just a learning curve plus the sometimes struggling focus otherwise it is a better camera than the S10.

I hope I get the update and all is well. I would hate to give up the great zoom capability at this point to try something else. Overall I'm happy with it. Samsung getting flack over problems only helps us all - all the negative feedback across the web forced them to release a fix for it. If no one complained they might of left it the way it was out of the box. Negative but accurate feedback about legit problems is beneficial feedback. It let's the companies know what's wrong so that they can fix it or at least try to fix it and also let's people know what's up so that they don't get hosed expecting one thing and getting another. That's why I give it praise where praise is due and negative feedback where negative feedback is due. Accurately, and unbiased, with no hidden agendas (I don't own any stocks in any of these companies) .

 

[chanchan05]

I believe the main issue with the S20 camera is probably their focus groups used for developing the software are Korean/Chinese millenials. Probably some other East and Southeast Asians as well. It's a culture thing.

I live in Southeast Asia so I can tell. The people this side of the world love the beauty filters and stuff that the Chinese and Koreans put on their phone cameras. It's one of the biggest things the youth around here look for, and to some extent measure the camera 'quality' on how it makes you 'prettier'. We even have memes here on those topics.

Some my former classmates, when I had the S7 Edge at the time, wants my phone for taking group pictures because she claims she looks 'prettier' on it, while deep inside I'm like 'girl you look like a plastic doll on it.'

Samsung's shortcoming is not giving an option to turn it's overagressive processing off. It's great hardware but the processing isn't professional.

 

[Mike Dee]

I believe the main issue with the S20 camera is probably their focus groups used for developing the software are Korean/Chinese millenials. Probably some other East and Southeast Asians as well. It's a culture thing.

I live in Southeast Asia so I can tell. The people this side of the world love the beauty filters and stuff that the Chinese and Koreans put on their phone cameras. It's one of the biggest things the youth around here look for, and to some extent measure the camera 'quality' on how it makes you 'prettier'. We even have memes here on those topics.

Some my former classmates, when I had the S7 Edge at the time, wants my phone for taking group pictures because she claims she looks 'prettier' on it, while deep inside I'm like 'girl you look like a plastic doll on it.'

Samsung's shortcoming is not giving an option to turn it's overagressive processing off. It's great hardware but the processing isn't professional.

Sounds good but it's not only sold in Asian markets so I would think the have different focus groups in other markets. Also they are not the only device made in that part of the world. You can also turn the beauty mode off.

 

[ThrottleJohnny]

Sounds good but it's not only sold in Asian markets so I would think the have different focus groups in other markets. Also they are not the only device made in that part of the world. You can also turn the beauty mode off.

I suspect beauty mode also has it's fans here in the US. Sometimes we forget that we phone enthusiasts represent a small part of any company's customer base.

It should be a feature that can be completely muted though, without having to use manual mode.